# Self Sufficiency/Living off the Land or Off the Grid > General Homesteading >  off grid in Nevada

## nbaker

Hi there folks. New to this group!

Looking for ideas for the new land. Bought 53 acres in northern central Nv. Planning on building on this land to hopefully one day be able to move out there full time. There is nothing near. No electric or water. I plan on putting in a septic system with time. We have one at our current house we own in the mountains in Cali. We plan on using solar energy for electric for simple uses such as a fridge freezer. We don't really use lights in our current home. My one concern is water. In Nv you don't need a permit to drill a well but it's expensive. It's illegal to use rain water but come on its Nv. I don't think 3" of water a yr will do us any good. Any other ideas? 

We will be using propane for cooking like we do in our current home and wood burning stove for heat like we currently do. 

I am curious what kind of animals we could farm with and recommendations on quantity due to water concerns and extreme heat. This will be for a family of 2 and a crap load of dogs  :Smile:  

Thank you for your input!

----------


## kyratshooter

There is a reason that land is cheap, empty and uninhabited.

Think about it.

Your area is known as "The Great Basin", where the Indians looked foreword to the big grasshopper harvest for most of their stored winter food.

Livestock can not live there or it would be under grazing right now and not for sale.

It is doubtful that the present solar technology is going to support your freezer/refrigerator without massive battery banks.

Your water is going to have to be shipped in and placed in a holding tank.

You are still dependent on a propane supply.

Now, is being "off the grid" real when you are still dependent on a "delivery system" other than the "grid" so you can maintain the present lifestyle of a grid connected family +dogs.

You are simply exchanging the convenience of a grid system with the problems and headaches of not having a grid system.

----------


## LowKey

There are propane fueled refrigerators and freezers. But you are still dependent on fuel. 
And everything Kyrat said too.
If you want water, you drill that well. Otherwise, that will be a pretty useless piece of land.

----------


## hunter63

Hunter63 saying Hey and Welcome..
There is an intro section at:.....If you care to stop by and say hello.
http://www.wilderness-survival.net/f...-Introductions

Those questions are the one you inquire about before buying property, so you have a good idea of what you have to deal with.


Do you own water/mineral  rights?
How far from grid?
Average cost of a viable solar system can run $30K or more.....
What kind of live stock did you think about having?

Rancher friend in Wyoming use to say it took 9 acres of grass to feed one beef.....or 3 antelope, so allowed us to hunt is 30,000 acre ranch.

----------


## kyratshooter

I think this is that same area where the guy was here two or three years ago was located.

You remember, he was the one that inherited 100 acre dry farm and moved onto it with ponies, goats and pigs.  First the goats ran off, then the pigs ran off, then his wife got up early one morning and stole the pony and ran off to the truck-stop on I-80 and hitched a ride to the nearest town.

That story kept us entertained for several days!

Didn't we finally have to ban him?

----------


## Wise Old Owl

Drill baby Drill - a dry basin and 3" won't work.

----------


## kyratshooter

He is going to be off the grid and affordable solar will probably not create enough electricity to pump what he needs at the depth of the wells in that region.  

He is going to be drilling hundreds of feet deep to reach a questionable water table.

This is why the population density of the region is only 2 people per sq/m with most of those people clustered around interstate off ramps.

And we are not even facing the difficulties in getting a mortgage or construction loan for an off grid home.  Lending institutions are allergic to this level of risk.

----------


## hunter63

> Drill baby Drill - a dry basin and 3" won't work.


Water rights, water rights....check it out.

----------


## kyratshooter

Hunter is right in this warning.

in the western US it is possible to own land but not own the water that is under it or flows over it.

Since there are already restrictions on collection or rain water in this area I would expect other restrictions to be in force.  

In the western US water is life and always has been.  Some of the water rights laws go all the way back to the Spanish land grants with the Crown giving not the land, but the water of an area to indicate control of that area.

----------


## Seniorman

> Kyratshooter - " ... In the western US water is life and always has been. ..."


Yep.  Notwithstanding all the sensationalistic and inaccurate Hollywood western movies over the years depicting cowboys and indians and outlaws constantly shooting it out, far, far more blood was shed over water in the real Old West.

S.M.

----------


## BENESSE

I'm totally in the dark on this and just have to ask: how on earth could there be restrictions on _rain_ water? How does that even work?
If nbaker is sitting on 53 acres out in the middle of nowhere, will someone check up on him every time it rains?

----------


## hunter63

> I'm totally in the dark on this and just have to ask: how on earth could there be restrictions on _rain_ water? How does that even work?
> If nbaker is sitting on 53 acres out in the middle of nowhere, will someone check up on him every time it rains?


Colorado is bad....even with rain water.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs...-on-your-home/

California changed their laws in 2012
https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/f...01120120AB1750

Now in the OP the inquiry was for Nevada ....so checking on rights may be wise.

http://water.nv.gov/waterrights/

----------


## BENESSE

To read the California Rainwater Capture Act one would infer they actually encourage capture of rainwater not restrict (which would make more sense IMO):

_(c) Rainwater and stormwater, captured  and properly managed, can contribute 						  significantly to local water supplies by infiltrating and  recharging groundwater aquifers, thereby increasing available supplies  of drinking water. In addition, the onsite capture, storage, 						  and use of rainwater for nonpotable uses significantly reduces  demand for potable water, contributing to the statutory objective of a  20-percent reduction in urban per capita water use in California by  December 31, 2020.
_
_(d) Expanding  opportunities for rainwater capture to augment water supply will require  efforts at all levels, from individual landowners to state and local  agencies and watershed managers._

----------


## hunter63

Yeah, that was after the drought was getting serious......
I not picking out laws....just saying to be aware....before buying.....

One must be aware of what the laws are anywhere if they are planning on buying and building.
Most anything CAN be done....but some laws make that very hard to do legally and usually a lot more money.

In our area at "The Place"......land is all hills and valleys.....level ground at a premium....flood plain land can't be built on.
Rivers and streams are governed by navigable water way and wetland laws.
Many local laws involving perk for septic, driveway grading inclines, and amount of land that can be built on.

Interesting situation was/is 2 families purchased 40 acres together.....need 30 acres to build a dwelling.....who gets to build? and how about the 1/2 owner?

Nothing there yet.....I have dealing with the owners as I use a field access road to get to a hunting spot.
One year the guy I had always talked to and gotten permission from...was in discussion on who owns what.
Turned out OK....But.

So again.....Questions on laws. codes. rules, rights should be asked and answered BEFORE buying, UNLESS you are prepared to deal the with the more expensive options.
PS.... this was learned the hard way.

----------


## Wildthang

Maybe he could raise camels?????

----------


## kyratshooter

That might be the best move if he can get around the EPA invasive species regulations!

----------


## hunter63

Hasn't been back....Hummmm

I guess we were supposed to say only positive stuff.

----------


## kyratshooter

> Hasn't been back....Hummmm
> 
> I guess we were supposed to say only positive stuff.


Yep a one grenade toss wonder.

I got a flyer in the mail from a company trying to sell me land in Colorado just across the state line from where this guy is.  $1000 per acre for land that takes 5 square miles to feed a jackrabbit.  Minimum parcel was 30 acres.  Pictures of lakes, rivers, green meadows and tall pines instead of the gravel pans, scrub brush and creosote bush it really is.

----------


## hunter63

So, seems he already bought 53 acres, @$1000 per is $53 K.

Wonder if it has a road to it?
Sold for BLM?

----------


## Rick

Nevada has a lot of lakes in that area but for some strange reason they are all named Dry Lake. Weird. Perhaps if he hangs on to that land long enough they will rename all the lakes to Wet Lake and he'll be sitting pretty.

----------


## hunter63

If California falls into the ocean...ocean front property?

Oh, yeah...some one complained about using that analogy...If I remember correctly.

----------


## Loneviking

BTW, rainwater collection in Nevada is legal if you have water rights. So yes, make darn sure of your water rights.

----------


## backtobasics

> Hi there folks. New to this group!
> 
> Looking for ideas for the new land. Bought 53 acres in northern central Nv. Planning on building on this land to hopefully one day be able to move out there full time. There is nothing near. No electric or water. I plan on putting in a septic system with time. We have one at our current house we own in the mountains in Cali. We plan on using solar energy for electric for simple uses such as a fridge freezer. We don't really use lights in our current home. My one concern is water. In Nv you don't need a permit to drill a well but it's expensive. It's illegal to use rain water but come on its Nv. I don't think 3" of water a yr will do us any good. Any other ideas? 
> 
> We will be using propane for cooking like we do in our current home and wood burning stove for heat like we currently do. 
> 
> I am curious what kind of animals we could farm with and recommendations on quantity due to water concerns and extreme heat. This will be for a family of 2 and a crap load of dogs  
> 
> Thank you for your input!


I  lived off grid in northern Nevada for 3 years. If the land is clay the water may not be drinkable from a well and growing will be hard. We collected wild horse manure off the roads for the garden. I had a good friend nearby that let me use his well and we hauled water. There was also a spring not to far that many used for water. Water is #1. We learned to brush our teeth with 1 cup of water. We used little electricity. 2 solar panels and a couple of batteries. Generator for power tools and washing machine. Propane frig and freezer. For animals I mostly saw poultry some cows tho. It really depends on the land. My neighbor less than a half mile away and the land was much different. If you can get good water drill. Ask the people in the area.

----------


## backtobasics

One more thing solar will pull the water that is how my friend had his set up.

----------


## backtobasics

> I'm totally in the dark on this and just have to ask: how on earth could there be restrictions on _rain_ water? How does that even work?
> If nbaker is sitting on 53 acres out in the middle of nowhere, will someone check up on him every time it rains?


They will never check. We were north of Reno still in Washoe county where outhouse are illegal but everyone had one and some collected rain water as well.

----------


## kyratshooter

A moot point in an area that gets less than 10 inches of rainfall per year, and much of that as snow.

----------


## backtobasics

True one could not live on rain water alone but in the desert every drop counts. Unless you have a well then your good.

----------


## WalkingTree

Assuming a scenario wherein someone is able (financially) to put such engineering into something (but are needing to avoid always buying water and having it trucked in)...I wonder if it's a good idea to try and design a habitat that is a quasi-closed system which doesn't let any of it's humidity out and constantly condenses it out of the air, gardens which are inside with a glass wall and below ground it is separated from the ground outside also - in order to effectively recycle as much water as you *do* have and have things set up so that the same water passively/actively cycles constantly through it's many uses. I know that some Earthships are like this in that their gray water goes to their gardens and then a couple of other things long before it is ultimately released. I guess the biggest problem would be the water from your bodily wastes - properly processing such wastes yet extracting the water from it, yet not having things be stinky.

Maybe your black-waste garden and pond with the right flora and fauna (and something with that bacteria that you can get) is indoors, to always take the humidity from that air putting it back into the system after it transpires from the leaves and everywhere else...but this area is sealed off from the rest of the house, airlocked. Or, you can have those toilets which dehydrate the stuff, before it goes to the next stage of composting, and the water after removing the stinky gas is reclaimed.

Wouldn't do the trick completely, but in combination with what little water you get from the ground or rain, might take care of everything?

And so...I'm sure that the right such-minded person can come up with a simpler DIY redneck set-up to do this kind of thing to some extent.

edit - Just make your outhouse a big greenhouse garden which you accept is always a little stinky, and the ground and airspace is a closed system, and water is condensed out and reclaimed.

I'm thinking the real problem with all this is that in a really closed system you do have some things which build up and get out of balance, and you may end up with diseases in the air or somewhere because it's so closed.

----------


## finallyME

The only purpose for Northern Nevada is to drive through it to the coast.  Of course, my luck driving though it last week was a blizzard from Winnemucca to Utah.  I consider Nevada a buffer between me and Cali.  When society collapses and So Cal runs out of water, they won't be able to make it to Utah.  They will all die in Nevada.  :Smile:

----------


## finallyME

> Assuming a scenario wherein someone is able (financially) to put such engineering into something (but are needing to avoid always buying water and having it trucked in)...I wonder if it's a good idea to try and design a habitat that is a quasi-closed system which doesn't let any of it's humidity out and constantly condenses it out of the air, gardens which are inside with a glass wall and below ground it is separated from the ground outside also - in order to effectively recycle as much water as you *do* have and have things set up so that the same water passively/actively cycles constantly through it's many uses. I know that some Earthships are like this in that their gray water goes to their gardens and then a couple of other things long before it is ultimately released. I guess the biggest problem would be the water from your bodily wastes - properly processing such wastes yet extracting the water from it, yet not having things be stinky.
> 
> Maybe your black-waste garden and pond with the right flora and fauna (and something with that bacteria that you can get) is indoors, to always take the humidity from that air putting it back into the system after it transpires from the leaves and everywhere else...but this area is sealed off from the rest of the house, airlocked. Or, you can have those toilets which dehydrate the stuff, before it goes to the next stage of composting, and the water after removing the stinky gas is reclaimed.
> 
> Wouldn't do the trick completely, but in combination with what little water you get from the ground or rain, might take care of everything?
> 
> And so...I'm sure that the right such-minded person can come up with a simpler DIY redneck set-up to do this kind of thing to some extent.
> 
> edit - Just make your outhouse a big greenhouse garden which you accept is always a little stinky, and the ground and airspace is a closed system, and water is condensed out and reclaimed.
> ...



You can do it.... think biosphere for Mars.  Won't be cheap.

----------

