# Survival > Foraging & Wild Edibles >  wild foragers? doomsday preppers?

## feral chef

ok so i saw some of the show doomsday preppers on tv and i was wondering (not a good thing, i know.) While we might all agree a knowledge of wild edibles is useful if society falls,  have any of us gained interest in this field in preperation for the impending doom?  I somewhat would have to say yes for myself.  Although i also gained an interest beause i am cheap (wild foods are generally free), and i love to cook. But i do also believe our society will eventually undergo some major upheaval.  So anyway.......  what do yall think. any other doomsday preppers out there?

----------


## crashdive123

> .......have any of us gained interest in this field in preperation for the impending doom?.....


Nope......

----------


## jake abraham

a little bit

----------


## Rick

Nope. Wild foods are just part of nature's garden. To me picking purslane out of the garden is no different than picking leaf lettuce.

----------


## Winter

I wish I knew more about edibles here. I learn from a hands on approach best and I know no local expert. Identifying lichen is tough.

----------


## dchev88

I, too, just watched that episode and started researching edible & medicinal plants right after the show. Always good info to have.

----------


## your_comforting_company

I've been studying wild plants for a good while now, and I have quite a few books on the subject, including permaculture and edible landscapes. It's not as much "Doomsday prepping" for me, as much as it is a simple interest in knowing and understanding the world I live in. Beekeeping has added a whole new dimension to wild plants as some that are useless to us for consumption are terriffic pollen and nectar plants (and some are toxic to both us and the bees). It's really good fun to be out hiking a trail and find a nice sweet snack or sour leaf for a "tea". We make it into a game, lots of times, when driving or hiking, to see who can name the plants we see. Gathering them can be made into a fun game too, Where we share our snacks and see who can name the mystery fruits! No peeking!
I guess my answer is no, because I'm not doing it for doomsday. I'm doing it because I have a genuine interest.

----------


## kyratshooter

It is a moot point.

Hunter gatherer societies require land by the square mile/per person to survive.   Most studies have shown that it requires at least one sq/mi per person in areas of abundant rescources.  You are not going to live on the dandilions in your yard and the weeds on the roadside.  

In the areas of the western U.S. many of the areas require up to 40 sq/mi for sustaining life, if you would call it that.  I am refering to the "Digger Indians" of the desert and the Shoshone of the Great Basin culture who considered the grasshopper plague a bumper food source.   No, they were not living fat and happy eating corn and buffalo.  They were barely staying alive day to day and hiding from the stronger tribes as they scrounged.  And to think, it is their hunter/gatherer woodcraft that the westerners value so highly!

In the eastern U.S. the lowest popultation density is 43 in Maine and almost 1,200 in New Jersey, with the average sitting around 200/psm.  Even here in rural KY I am going to be in competition with 100 other people for my SQ/MI.

How do we sustain high populatuon density?  

Agriculture.  

The "hunter/gatherers" of the east were heavily invested in agriculture and were able to sustain towns of up to 60,000 by using simple farming techniques and planned land use.

You'd better stockpile some seed.

----------


## hunter63

Foraging is another tool in the box, not an end all solution, IMHO.

It's a skill that need to be practiced as any other skill has to be.

The "I gonna buy me a book on wild food and put it in my BOB to live by when the time comes"....isn't gonna work....but seems like that is a the approch a lot of people take.......and lately its "I have an app for that".

----------


## natertot

I like your thoughts, kyrat. Seeds for a large garden is what I think is a food idea. One of many things still to do!

----------


## Rick

Great post, KY! My garden isn't large but I would guess that it augments about a quarter of our vegetable food needs AT HARVEST TIME. It contributes nothing but longing in the winter. Someone pass me the flies and spiders, please.

----------


## hunter63

Seeds of known plants are a valuable resource, no doubt, as is the knowledge to use it.
"Putting food by" is the other part of the whole picture.

Hummmm, seems I'm referencing my ancestors here.

----------


## feral chef

> It is a moot point.
> 
> Hunter gatherer societies require land by the square mile/per person to survive.   Most studies have shown that it requires at least one sq/mi per person in areas of abundant rescources.  You are not going to live on the dandilions in your yard and the weeds on the roadside.  
> 
> In the areas of the western U.S. many of the areas require up to 40 sq/mi for sustaining life, if you would call it that.  I am refering to the "Digger Indians" of the desert and the Shoshone of the Great Basin culture who considered the grasshopper plague a bumper food source.   No, they were not living fat and happy eating corn and buffalo.  They were barely staying alive day to day and hiding from the stronger tribes as they scrounged.  And to think, it is their hunter/gatherer woodcraft that the westerners value so highly!
> 
> In the eastern U.S. the lowest popultation density is 43 in Maine and almost 1,200 in New Jersey, with the average sitting around 200/psm.  Even here in rural KY I am going to be in competition with 100 other people for my SQ/MI.
> 
> How do we sustain high populatuon density?  
> ...


ok so i think you have it wrong in a doomsday scenario there isnt high population density.  People have either died off or i killed them off (j/k). But i think if you combine an exstensive knowledge of all aspects of wilderness survival (foraging making your own tool and weapons etc etc) with good hunting/trapping skills, and hard work.  You could provide for a family, and quite well i think.  Which i think goes along with what hunter said. "Foraging is another tool in the box, not an end all solution"

----------


## Rick

Sort of depends on your reason for Armageddon. There is nothing in the rules that says everyone but you dies. There's also nothing in the rules that says they die immediately. Chernobyl is an example of people surviving but the food sources on the land would not be usable. One thing most hunter/gatherer societies had in common, they were generally malnourished. You might provide for your family but the "quite well" part is certainly questionable.

----------


## crashdive123

To add something that has been stated before - many of the hunter/gatherer groups were nomadic in nature.

----------


## Rick

That's an excellent point, Crash. As humans would eat fruits, etc. they would also deposit the seeds along with a little fertilizer. The next year or two or three they would find new fruit trees, berries, etc. growing. So we contributed to the food ecosystem as well. But staying in one spot and living off the land depletes your resources. There are several examples where entire civilizations were unsustainable. Easter Island and the Anasazi are two groups that depleted the wood in their area and no longer had cooking or building materials.

----------


## BENESSE

Basic skills are transcendent, no question about it. But we can never go back to that period of time, we can only build on it. We have to evolve and _excel_ if we want to make it in the 21st century.

----------


## wholsomback

Yes to be part of a hunter gatherer society you move where the food is.If doomsday does happen you don't wanna be where all the people are cause food will go quickly.Whether by buying or looting,by force or giving it is best to stay away from crowds,they are more deadly than helpful.Remember unless you are in a group of people with iron wills people are like cattle(no offense to anyone just learned through experience),they will follow the mob if they think it will benifit them or family.Make a quick easy for all to follow plan on where to meet and what to bring and go.Thats it plain and simple,if Katrina is any clue just look what would of happened if relief had not arrived, it would have spiraled out of complete control.Just something to keep in mind if you are ever in a bad place.Remember the old sayin Keep it Simple Stupid( KISS ) even in military life it has served me well.The Myans depleted themselves out of existance too.

----------


## bushrat82

Much of what you see in disasters, natural or otherwise, is an effect of hysteria.  Folks without the confidence to take stock in what they actually have and work from there will begin to act out of fear.  Couple the inability to use the acronym "SURVIVAL" with a lack of personal defense skills and you have a recipe for chaos.  Many of the people who cause problems in disaster are selfish and can't stand the thought of going without 3 meals (or more..) per day.  Nothing wrong with wanting to be well fed, but it's good to accept that you may not always be and keep your wits about you.

----------


## mountainmark

> Hunter gatherer societies require land by the square mile/per person to survive.   Most studies have shown that it requires at least one sq/mi per person in areas of abundant rescources.  You are not going to live on the dandilions in your yard and the weeds on the roadside.


KS, could you provide the source of these studies? I would be interested to know who cunducted them, how many plants they took into account, were they factoring in all the edible plants in the areas or just the well known ones, animal life, what type of skill the gatherers had (if they had actual gatherers), etc.

I'm NOT calling you out on this, just would love to see the studies. Thanks in advance.

mark

----------


## Batch

I have been studying as best I can the Seminoles traditional foods. I have also tried to learn some of the pre-columbian tribes food sources. Also the pioneers of the late 1800's and early 1900's down here in S Florida.

It turns out that all seemed to have passed over good eats on the misinformation that the meat or plant was no good or poisonous.

I grew up mullet was bait. Its also a delicacy in 10,000 islands. Gar was a trash fish, but, the Seminoles loved it and I have friends that swear by it. We through grunts back and then the Cubans tell us how good it is. Seminoles ate gator eggs and did not eat gator. We used to toss amber jack because they had worms. Till somebody made some smoked fish dip. Grouper heads went in the garbage. But, I got a buddy who spends hours cleaning the head and making fish head soup. Look at all of the stuff we throw away that used to get eaten. Pig ears are a delicacy. But you have to boil them for hours and hours first or they are inedible.

When I was up in Madison earlier this year we were picking Poke Salet. I was reading my notes and telling Uncle Robert that he is picking the wrong leaves. That we should only take young leaves. He rightly told me that I had never done this and he had done it his whole life. 

Northerners eat the root and we eat the green. We can argue that the turnip is better then the turnip greens or vice verse. Or we can accept that both are damned good if you'll take the time to learn how to prepare it right. Though it does lend some credibility to our contention that yankees ain't all there that they don't eat collard greens! LOL

I think we have an incomplete view of foraging. I also, personally, don't think that if you actually ever have a SHTF TEOTWAWKI situation. That trying to grow cultivated plants is the way to go. You will fight more nutritional, disease resistant plants to grow things you have adapted to. There is some speculation that you will have eaten your last banana in a few years. Because a disease is devastating the one species of several thousand  that we have taken a liking to. The other thousands of related fruits are still nutritional powerhouse. But are used differently. Also, we don't eat the plant or the flower and both are edible with some claiming the bud as the best eats and the stalks as a really good pickled food. 

What else do we over look daily?

----------


## hikingpeter

Carp is a delicacy in Poland--a junk fish in the US.

Anyway, I think that foraging knowledge will give you a leg up against the competition, since it's almost completely unknown in our culture. Guns are more widespread than foraging knowledge--are squirrels going to go extinct after TSHTF??

----------


## Graf

I have been studing wild edibles and medcinal plants for about 4 years now, increasing my knowldege all the time. It amazes me the abundance of natures garden. Slowly teaching my grandson about this as well as trapping, fishing, hunting so he may survive long after I'm gone. 
Will wild edibles sustain you in a SHTF senario? It will help with all the vitamins in wild ediles if they are avialable, not flooded, burned or contaminated. Planting gardens is also something I'm prepping for, however if your forced to leave your home and the garden has not produced yet you will wish you have some knowledge of wild edibles. To many folks focus on being able to stay put in a SHTF senario. Just look at what happens during natural disasters many times theres nothing left.

----------


## jcullen24

I've been reading Samual Thayer's Book:  Forager's Harvest

I just ordered his other book: Nature's Garden

Very well written.  Just like Hunter said,  It's another tool in the kit.  I've been noticing more edibles thanks to the book. 
Thistle as an edible, who woulda thunk it!  

I also like the SAS Survival Handbook by John 'Lofty' Wiesman.

----------


## jcullen24

> Carp is a delicacy in Poland--a junk fish in the US.
> 
> Anyway, I think that foraging knowledge will give you a leg up against the competition, since it's almost completely unknown in our culture. Guns are more widespread than foraging knowledge--are squirrels going to go extinct after TSHTF??


Interesting statement on the squirrels. I read somewhere that during the Great Depression squirrels, and rabits were endangered around the cities because they were the first thing that came to mind when people were hunting for food.

----------


## hunter63

> Carp is a delicacy in Poland--a junk fish in the US.
> 
> Anyway, I think that foraging knowledge will give you a leg up against the competition, since it's almost completely unknown in our culture. Guns are more widespread than foraging knowledge--are squirrels going to go extinct after TSHTF??


LOL, reminds me of a couple of older guys from Poland that worked in our factory, had come back with some carp, Stanislaw and Cassmier, came in with a bunch of carp.....One other the other guys says, "Hey you can't eat those'....and Stan says "Vell in my country we call trrout"....(had to roll the 'r's" a little).

----------


## Celticwarrior

I have made great strides in doing edible landscaping in both my 4 acre homestead and my 20 acre hunting plot. Both have a number of edible fruit trees, berries, grapes, ground covers, and various 'domestic' herbs like onion, garlic, chives, sage, basil, etc. Lots of edible weeds like chicory, lamb's quarter, purslaine, plaintain, dandelion, carrot, and so on.  However, none of that would take the place of meat and starches. Hate to say it, but no amount of gardening is going to take the place of hunting or raising some animals for protein. Luckily, I have also grown various crops and green manures that also draw in animals like rabbit and deer and make them hang around until hunting season.

----------


## Ted

> I have made great strides in doing edible landscaping in both my 4 acre homestead and my 20 acre hunting plot. Both have a number of edible fruit trees, berries, grapes, ground covers, and various 'domestic' herbs like onion, garlic, chives, sage, basil, etc. Lots of edible weeds like chicory, lamb's quarter, purslaine, plaintain, dandelion, carrot, and so on.  However, none of that would take the place of meat and starches. Hate to say it, but no amount of gardening is going to take the place of hunting or raising some animals for protein. Luckily, I have also grown various crops and green manures that also draw in animals like rabbit and deer and make them hang around until hunting season.


I like your thinkin' .....why be weedin', when you could be eaten'...LOL!!!

----------


## Adair

That is one of the main reasons I joined this site, so I could survive after this upheaval that is bound to happen. that and I think it sounds like fun

----------


## hunter63

> That is one of the main reasons I joined this site, so I could survive after this upheaval that is bound to happen. that and I think it sounds like fun


What part of an upheaval sounds like fun?....

Foraging, gardening, raising live stock, farming, hunting and fishing, is a life style that will help you no matter what......But to HAVE to do it to survive isn't gonna be fun.

----------


## wareagle69

does anyone know of anyone in real life that lives completely off of wild edibles? and that means anything wild, plant/ animal waht have you.....
i would think if there is anyone it is completly rare. look at history(not that i know much about history) but it seems more of the native peoples finally ended up farming, yes nomadic mooving where the food is, but from every thing i have studied about corn, they grew a ton of it, then taught the european settlers how to grow it, and  they took it back home, as it grows in a multitude of climates.
I have studies wild edibles for about 7 yrs now, and they are an excellent supplement to my food stocks that grow w/o any effert on my part, so when i am out hunting/foraging for food, i can gather at the same time-economics of energy-still need to grow food- still need a village to harvest it.
what i think about is that i spend allot of time in my area, i know some good spots for wild edibles, and if i had to walk to all locations to gather, not sure if the effort would be worth vs gardening. Now if you do not live in the area and you are trying to live off wild edibles i would say your chances are greatly reduced. Just my opinion from someone who lives for wild edibles

----------


## feral chef

i have encountered people who live completly off the grid combining wild edibles with farming and hunting\raising livestock. but not yet one who only eats wild food.  i believe god gave us a brain to be able to learn things like farming. while there may be some out there i know of no animal that farms plants though some creatures keep other animals as pets\slaves.

----------


## wareagle69

i agree with you feral chef, i use plants like mallow for starch to thicken instead of flour or make flour out of acorn and clover. My comment was/is directed at those doomsayers who think they are going to go rouge after shtf and live off the land, i don't think(in my limited brain capacity) that it can be done, is it possible? might be, but evry show i have ever seen ,every book i have ever read, the folks living way off grid have still had to have supplies of some sort.
 I learn for many reasons, first and foremost the challenge of it, second, kind of sort of how i plan on eating when i retire, third, it fills me with great satisfaction to eat from the garden or the wild.

----------


## oldsoldier

> ok so i think you have it wrong in a doomsday scenario there isnt high population density.  People have either died off or i killed them off (j/k). But i think if you combine an exstensive knowledge of all aspects of wilderness survival (foraging making your own tool and weapons etc etc) with good hunting/trapping skills, and hard work.  You could provide for a family, and quite well i think.  Which i think goes along with what hunter said. "Foraging is another tool in the box, not an end all solution"


fc... like mentioned before, depending on the scenerio of "doomsday".  If it's a world wide 2012 movie kind of scenerio, or an asteroid strike, ice age type scenerio then there likely won't be much left to forage.. But if it's a global pandemic type thing then yes it is possible. That being said I have been into herbal/medicinal/edible plants for over 40 years. Started with my cherokee grandparents when I was 7-8. Currently I am quite familiar with and use several dozen plants in my area and have working knowledge with a few dozen more. Would I depend on that knowledge soley in a survival situation? Not if I have other options. Same with counting on wild game to survive. I can and have made very servicable bows as well as the arrows for them, I can and have hunted with them as well, I can also make a useable black powder and cast my own ball for a muzzle loader as well but won't count on those for sole survival tools either. I agree that if these are added sources of supplies to strech what you have and offer some variety in your "tool box" as well. But having the seeds and supplies for gardening is a more likely long term thing you could better depend on.

----------


## wareagle69

Feral Chef just a thought / comment / suggestion, have you read my thread called "An Absoulte Must Read" its a sticky somewhere, i read it about 5 yrs ago and it made me rethink alot, just a suggestion mate.

----------


## Crooked Bird

feralchef, I'd say I'm sort of like you. A lot of why I do this is because it's cheap, and here I am living right up against the woods without a car for Pete's sake, "get out in the woods and learn whatever you can from them" is the cheapest, most accessible hobby I can go for! And it makes me feel alive to be outdoors. But I have doomsday in the back of my mind a little, and I agree with others that it would be smarter to have enough skills so if you have to leave your homestead you may actually make it. I'm nowhere near there yet but I am slowly building up my skills. And then, you know, doomsday may not be some sort of kaboom. It might be running out of oil, everything gets more expensive, our economy continues downward, sooner or later we're a Third World country. In that case I still need all those skills (and gardening's a big one, but wild edibles would help a lot with supplementing, people do it that way in Third World countries), maybe just to "get by" rather than "survive", but at some point it comes to the same thing.

BTW, everyone, y'all use acronyms a LOT. I figured out TEOTWAKI but what the heck is SHTF? Looks a little too much like STFU.

----------


## Psalm25

> feralchef, I'd say I'm sort of like you. A lot of why I do this is because it's cheap, and here I am living right up against the woods without a car for Pete's sake, "get out in the woods and learn whatever you can from them" is the cheapest, most accessible hobby I can go for! And it makes me feel alive to be outdoors. But I have doomsday in the back of my mind a little, and I agree with others that it would be smarter to have enough skills so if you have to leave your homestead you may actually make it. I'm nowhere near there yet but I am slowly building up my skills. And then, you know, doomsday may not be some sort of kaboom. It might be running out of oil, everything gets more expensive, our economy continues downward, sooner or later we're a Third World country. In that case I still need all those skills (and gardening's a big one, but wild edibles would help a lot with supplementing, people do it that way in Third World countries), maybe just to "get by" rather than "survive", but at some point it comes to the same thing.
> 
> BTW, everyone, y'all use acronyms a LOT. I figured out TEOTWAKI but what the heck is SHTF? Looks a little too much like STFU.


s**t hits the fan.

----------


## crashdive123

*@ Crooked Bird*......here is a list of acronyms http://www.wilderness-survival.net/f...ions-and-Terms

----------


## japs8944

While I think that most of the people on that show are crazy, I am definaty of a fashion a prepper.

----------


## Outdoorguy

I am into wild eatables, but with it comes the study of food preservation. Gotta keep in mind if TSHTF in such a way, there's probably going to be no way to store food. Nomadic tribes were nomadic partially for that reason, they traveled to where the harvest was. In New England, there isn't much to forage in the winter time. You would need to not only harvest eatables (A majority of the best ones are found in the spring.) but also be able to preserve it to last through the winter.
Also, you could incorporate replanting into many of your foraging endevors. Horse Radish is an awesome example, because it is invasive, and easy to replant.

----------

