# Survival > Bushcraft Medicine >  My first aid kit

## finallyME

This weekend, and in a few weeks, I plan to take the boys scouts backpacking.  This weekend is a 2 nighter/ 15 miler, and in July is a 5 nighter/ 30+ miler.  I am actually getting a good sized troop (we might actually have 11 this weekend), so I have been thinking about beefing out my first aid kit a little better.  Also, I have always considered my kit lacking something.  And, I never liked the way I carried it before (just in a roll top bag).  So, I went and bought a fancy Condor Rip Away pouch, and used my Flex Spending to fill it with high speed stuff.  I put together a video showing what I put in the kit.  A quick disclaimer first:   This is the stuff I am trained to use.  I thought about adding a few other things, but decided against because of lack of training in those things.




For those who don't or can't watch youtube, I took a couple pictures.

Here it is all laid out in the pouch.  Everything is tucked away, nothing is loose.
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Going from left to right, here is the left side:
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From top left, there are two baggies with small gauze squares in sealed packages, along with a bit of paper towel folded up.
EMT shears
tweezers
providone iodine solution for sterilizing water for irrigation
a 30 ml irrigation syringe
on the bottom left, steri strips for closing large cut
2 epi pens ( I have a scout who is allergic to bees)

Here is the middle section:
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Starting at top left is the green horse wrap.  It is a self adhering wrap that is cheaper and larger than what Walmart sells.
Quick Clot
two pairs of gloves 
middle left: blue cpr mask
4 inch Israeli bandage
bottom left: vacuum sealed compressed gauze
athletic cloth tape
triangular bandage

Here is the right section, from in the zippered pocket:
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Starting from top left: 1 suture kit ( I am not trained with this, I won't use it, only someone trained will, if available)
a bunch of butterfly bandages
triple antibiotic ointment packets
hydrocortizone packets
anti-diarrhea pills
chap stick
tylenol
advil
tape
Middle left: normal bandages
hydrocortizone pills
tums
heart burn- acid reflux OTC pills
bottom left: smaller bandages
iodine wipes
unknown pills (why you label pills)
skin super glue
sewing needle in cardboard case
sewing thread on bobbin
gorilla tape wrapped around piece of plastic
feminine hygiene product

Here is the full kit laid out
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It isn't as cool as Rick's, but I think it will do the job.  I plan to attach it to the back of my pack on the outside, so that it is easy to get to, but out of the way.

Here is a review of the bag itself:
http://www.wilderness-survival.net/f...415#post400415

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## Ken

Nice kit, FM.  I tend to carry a bit more, but you've got most of it covered for a hiking kit.  Any room in your pack for a SAM Splint and a thick 1'x1' sheet of plastic?

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## hunter63

Very cool......some time and planning went it to that.
Thanks for posting.

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## finallyME

I have a SAM splint and decided against it.  I figure I can improvise from nature with sticks and stuff.  I also debated on some type of chest seal.  I might get one, however, I do have large pieces of plastic sheet in my backpack (various garbage bags for keeping gear dry).
Thanks for reminding me to explain why I didn't include those items.

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## Rick

Great post. It's amazing how much stuff will fit in a Rip Away Pouch isn't it? Curious how you picked up the Epi's? Aren't they script only? 

It doesn't matter whether it's as good as mine or even better. What matters is whether it's right for you and your skills.

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## welderguy

> This weekend, and in a few weeks, I plan to take the boys scouts backpacking.  This weekend is a 2 nighter/ 15 miler, and in July is a 5 nighter/ 30+ miler.  I am actually getting a good sized troop (we might actually have 11 this weekend), so I have been thinking about beefing out my first aid kit a little better.  Also, I have always considered my kit lacking something.  And, I never liked the way I carried it before (just in a roll top bag).  So, I went and bought a fancy Condor Rip Away pouch, and used my Flex Spending to fill it with high speed stuff.  I put together a video showing what I put in the kit.  A quick disclaimer first:   This is the stuff I am trained to use.  I thought about adding a few other things, but decided against because of lack of training in those things.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> For those who don't or can't watch youtube, I took a couple pictures.
> 
> Here it is all laid out in the pouch.  Everything is tucked away, nothing is loose.
> Guests can not see images in the messages. Please register in the forum.
> ...


 I use the little pill bags to store my drugs I can write on them and its more compact than bottles. http://www.drugs.com/pill_identification.html

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## welderguy

> I have a SAM splint and decided against it.  I figure I can improvise from nature with sticks and stuff.  I also debated on some type of chest seal.  I might get one, however, I do have large pieces of plastic sheet in my backpack (various garbage bags for keeping gear dry).
> Thanks for reminding me to explain why I didn't include those items.


 
here is a link to an improvised chest seal.  http://adventuredoc.net/2013/01/05/i...ed-chest-seal/.
I may have overlooked it, but I saw nothing for burns.

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## Ken

I keep a small bottle of this in my kit:

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## Rick

I did a lot of reading on chest seals and have a couple different types. In all my readings the HALO appears to outperform all others. Here's an article the sums up the test pretty nicely. 

http://www.jems.com/article/industry...al-outperforms

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## welderguy

> I did a lot of reading on chest seals and have a couple different types. In all my readings the HALO appears to outperform all others. Here's an article the sums up the test pretty nicely. 
> 
> http://www.jems.com/article/industry...al-outperforms


I have all three in my bag, Halo , Asherman, and hyfin.  they all pretty much do the same job , in my personal experience its how well they stay adhered to the chest and halo is #1 .

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## finallyME

> here is a link to an improvised chest seal.  http://adventuredoc.net/2013/01/05/i...ed-chest-seal/.
> I may have overlooked it, but I saw nothing for burns.



Hey, you are right.  I even bought some burn gel to put in, and forgot.

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## finallyME

> I use the little pill bags to store my drugs I can write on them and its more compact than bottles. http://www.drugs.com/pill_identification.html


Thanks for the link.  I will use it when I get home to see what the mystery pills are.

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## welderguy

> Thanks for the link.  I will use it when I get home to see what the mystery pills are.


your welcome, i do that all the time thats why that link is on my favorites bar !! LOL

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## welderguy

> Great post. It's amazing how much stuff will fit in a Rip Away Pouch isn't it? Curious how you picked up the Epi's? Aren't they script only? 
> 
> It doesn't matter whether it's as good as mine or even better. What matters is whether it's right for you and your skills.


 Ebay .... Its amazing what can be had there !!
http://www.ebay.com/itm/EpiPen-2-pak...item3a81f5b8e8

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## finallyME

> Great post. It's amazing how much stuff will fit in a Rip Away Pouch isn't it? Curious how you picked up the Epi's? Aren't they script only? 
> 
> It doesn't matter whether it's as good as mine or even better. What matters is whether it's right for you and your skills.


The reason I have the epis is because of one scout who is allergic to bee stings.  His mom gave them to me.

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## finallyME

One thing I forgot to mention is that I purchased a bunch of the stuff from Chinook medical.  I found most of the stuff on Amazon, however, Chinook Medical took my Flex Spending card.
http://www.chinookmed.com/

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## Rick

I don't think I'd buy meds from eBay. I'd like to think that any EPI pen I get would have the real stuff in it and not kerosene or some other goop. 

Chinookmed is good. I've done some business with them and I've never had a problem. A bit pricey but (shrug).

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## finallyME

Alright, I added some burn cream, and found out the mystery drug is Diphenhydramine or Diphedryl, which is an antihistamine.  Thanks for all your help.

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## welderguy

> I don't think I'd buy meds from eBay. I'd like to think that any EPI pen I get would have the real stuff in it and not kerosene or some other goop. 
> 
> Chinookmed is good. I've done some business with them and I've never had a problem. A bit pricey but (shrug).


I wouldnt buy it from ebay either. but people do!!! I like north american rescue and rescue-essentials. two good companys.

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## welderguy

> Alright, I added some burn cream, and found out the mystery drug is Diphenhydramine or Diphedryl, which is an antihistamine.  Thanks for all your help.


BTW, if you carry prescription meds in your kit make sure there in the original bottle and in your name.

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## Sarge47

If you look at Rick's IFAK, you'll see that he lashed the SAM splint to the underside of the pouch on the outside..... :Sailor:

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## finallyME

One thing I think I forgot is something to remove ticks.  The horse wrap got used on my recent trip, one of the boys sprained his ankle slightly.

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## DSJohnson

So how did the hike/camp out turn out?  I was a Scoutmaster for about 10 years a long time ago.  I sure miss a lot of that.  Impressed with your first aid kit.  I usually "load up" on the vet wrap before we go out in the woods.  It is sure a great tool.  I am pretty fortunate I guess but my "primary care physician" is a pretty level headed guy and has written me scripts for Epi pens, nitro, O2 and some other meds, pretty much whatever I have been brave enough to ask for really.  He always questions me to make sure I know what they are to be used for and when.  Of course I used to be an NREMT-I in the ER where he works so we have some positive history there.

My question for you, since I have been out of scouting for a while (15 plus years), and don't know the protocol any more, do you have a signed current release to use the EPI pens from the parents or just their verbal permission? 

Also in Oklahoma regardless wither it is OTC or prescription it will be a whole lot better for you to keep all meds in their original packaging.  If for some reason you have some type of "issue" it just keeps everything that much easier.  I realize that space in a pack is very valuable but I like keeping things simple when I can.

Again that is an awesome kit.  Glad you are trying to take care of the kids.  Thank you for volunteering your time and effort!

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## Rick

Hey FM (and everyone else) - On your Quikclot, there is a Use By date on the back of the package. That is not an expiration date. The date is there to keep the company out of litigation more than anything. As long as the packaging is intact the product is still sterile. Even if you find the package is torn the product will work but it may not be sterile. Still, any port in a storm so if you have an arterial bleed then sterility becomes a second concern and one that can be treated after the fact. 

Inside the package is a mesh bag filled with Kaolin, which is a type of clay. It's inert so there is nothing to "expire". 

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Another problem you might see with the packaging is it may look swollen or bloated. If you find your package looking like that don't worry about it, it's fine. They do not vacuum seal the package even though it looks like they have. The product is baked at a high temperature as part of the manufacturing process. It then gets packaged into a heat shrink type of packaging. The package then shrinks around the product. So it isn’t vacuum sealed but rather the package simply shrinks. Some of the packages may not shrink as tight as others so it may look swollen. 

You might also hear small rattles inside the packaging if you shake it. The Kaolin is pretty small stuff. It is made of little beads 2mm in diameter (yes, I actually measured one) and one or two may slip through the mesh and rattle inside the package if you shake it. 

All that said, none of those conditions are problems and it's safe to use. I carry Quikclot that is 3-4 years beyond the date. I have no qualms about using it or it being used on me. So save yourself some money and just keep an eye on the packaging to make certain it is intact and still sterile and don't worry about the date on back unless you just want to.

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## finallyME

DSJ, sorry it took me so long to respond to your question.  I took two trips in the summer and they went great.  I ended up putting a 2" wide roll of silk tape in the kit before our week long trip, and pretty much used that the most.  One of the boys was/is just skin and bones, and his hip belt was giving him problems.  He just didn't have any natural padding on his hip....and his mom packed a whole lot of trail snacks.  So, we lightened his pack a little, and I cut 4" off his sleeping map and used the silk tape to tape it to his hip belt, doubling the padding on the belt.  Then I taped his back with the silk tape to prevent chaffing.  It worked really well.  We had a few minor cuts, but nothing serious.  It took two boys a day to tell me they had blisters.....even though I told them to tell me right away so we can take care of the problem before it gets bad.  I guess they learned a lesson.
With the epi-pen, all I have is verbal permission.

Rick, that is great info about quick-clot.  That stuff is expensive, and buying it every 5 years would start to get $$$$, especially if you have some in several kits.

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## 403Jeeping

Love this thread,  lots of great information!

What kind of pack is that?   I have a very compact kit that works OK, for hiking, tracking & traveling. 

Used it multiple times in mexico after snorkeling and a few scrapes and bruises sufferd while in mexico. .. saved us paying for medical attention

Sometimes it feels like I beed a better kit to contain my gear better.

Here is what I have been using.  Its easily attached to my pack,  Belt or stored in a checked luggage. ...

uploadfromtaptalk1397264766138.jpg 

Sent from my SGH-I747M using Tapatalk

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## 403Jeeping

Inside contents
uploadfromtaptalk1397265040131.jpg

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## Rick

If it works for you and you like it then that's all that matters. You said you "sometimes it feels I need a better kit". Once you get to the point that you feel your kit is no longer working for you then it's time to make some changes. Until then, if it's not broke then don't fix it.

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## finallyME

There is a link in the first post that goes to another thread and video describing the pack.


Keep in mind what type of kit this is, or basically the purpose behind it.  It is made for backpacking with a small group of youth.  If I was going solo, or with a group of adults, it would probably be different.  I have another kit for the car that is more extensive.  I also made one for my daughter to take to summer camp that is not so big.  Rick has a kit that is extensive enough to fit in a medium ALICE pack.

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## Adventure Wolf

I'm going to overhaul my first aid kit after this. I've been using a pre-made kit I bought online for awhile. After watching your video, I'm going to going to put a couple custom first aid kits together. I have taken a few first aid classes and I'm first aid/CPR certified.

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## hayshaker

i too have a couple epi-pens yes they are px-only. a week ago i was stung by a black hornet
and went into anaphalactic shock and almost died.in about 8min time from sting to passingout i had just enough time to dail
911 they found me on my deck. now i,m damm neer afried to leave the house to go in the yard cant wait
for winter. in the picture ihave the same pouch in acu and coyote brown.no chest seals though cause i don,t plan on treating any sucking chest wounds any how.because in a postshtf world it would,nt matter serious. example
you treat the patient but now the patient requires post trauma care do you have a private surgical bunker?
with surgical nurses,anistisioligists blah,blah see my point. icould go on but you get the point.any how nicekit

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## Rick

I don't carry chest seals in the event of some end of world scenario. I carry it because someone just might get shot or impaled. It's unfortunate but random shootings happen all the time. If it happens to a loved one then I want to be able to do everything I can to cover the golden hour until they can get transported to a Trauma center. If some world ending calamity happens I'll just be another casualty and won't have to worry about it. I have no misgivings thinking I'll survive when no one else does. That sucking chest wound could happen today or tomorrow in the course of just another average day.

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## Wildthang

Wow,

I carry a few bandaids, steri strips, needle & thread, tweezers, Iodine, Neosporin, gauze, large surgical tape, small bottle with various medications like Aspirin, Tylenol, and Pepto Bismol tablets, that's it! It fits in a small pouch and weighs nearly nothing! Would not fair well with gun shot wounds but small injuries it handles ok! I do not carry huge first aid kits because most injuries are small to large cuts, and broken bones, so being able to banadage a cut is probably on of the most important things you can have. Not much in any first aid kit for a broken arm or leg and that happens a lot!

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## Graf

A couple things I like to carry, Pottasium permanganate many medcinal uses, purifys water mixed with sugar or glycerin or antifreeze will start fire. Glycerin for chapped lips,wind burns,mix with Pottasium Permangante for fire. Sugar packets, again can mix with Pottasium Permanganate for fire, mix ith glecering for paste for small wounds that don't seem to heal correctly, energy boost, Cayene pepper i have used many times to stop bleeding n wounds that should have been stitched. I wrap containers with duct tape to act as bandages. pine pitch works well for both disinfecting and sealing small wounds. Charcoal from the camp fire pulverized will help reduce diarea. Always have a bandana or shemung for slings or ties. On my hiking packs and Bug Out bags I have full pretty well equipped first air kit.

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## hunter63

> Wow,
> 
> I carry a few bandaids, steri strips, needle & thread, tweezers, Iodine, Neosporin, gauze, large surgical tape, small bottle with various medications like Aspirin, Tylenol, and Pepto Bismol tablets, that's it! It fits in a small pouch and weighs nearly nothing! Would not fair well with gun shot wounds but small injuries it handles ok! I do not carry huge first aid kits because most injuries are small to large cuts, and broken bones, so being able to banadage a cut is probably on of the most important things you can have. Not much in any first aid kit for a broken arm or leg and that happens a lot!


I'm a basic guy as well......had a couple of extended kits, and found a lot of thing went bad....aspirins, Benadryl, alcohol pads, tape 
( stuck to itself ).....

Band-Aids, bandage pads tape and wraps are my basic, antibiotic, Carmex, Tums aspirin (fresh)....and my weeks worth of daily Meds.

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## hunter63

Graf....where are you getting Potassium permanganate?

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## Graf

> Graf....where are you getting Potassium permanganate?


Easy enough to find on line a bought a couple pounds quite a while ago and misplaced the link for source, but a friend of mine said he found it on line as well. The Glycerin can be bought a Walmarts in the first aid isle. The P.P. doesn't seem to go bad as long as you keep it dry and it only takes a couple grains for a canteen of water very slight pink hue is what your looking for.

Potassium Permagante other uses.docPotassium Permagante other uses.doc

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## Sarge47

> Graf....where are you getting Potassium permanganate?


Hunter, check on e-bay.  They have a bunch of listings.  I don't use it right now but maybe later.... :Flare:

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## Rick

You are welcome to carry PP if you want but that stuff will stain anything it touches including glass. It's also an oxidizer so fires involving it can be pretty intense. And don't mix it with glycerin or alcohol because there will be an explosive reaction! Given the down side of the stuff the up side isn't sufficient for me to carry it. There are other, safer things to do the same things PP will do. It's very good at what it does it's just too dangerous for me.

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## MrFixIt

Great read!
I need to overhaul my med kit!
I do carry Benadryl, in case of a wasp/bee/scorpion sting, and everything else is basic cut, burn, bumps/bruises related.
All stashed in a plastic Nalgene bottle.

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## Rick

Here is some information on PP from the EPA indicating it may not be effective against ghiardia or cryptosporida. 

Section 5.4.4.3

"No information pertaining to protozoa inactivation by potassium permanganate is available in the literature. However, based on the other disinfectants discussed in this report, protozoa are significantly more resistant than viruses; therefore, it is likely that the dosages and contact times required for protozoa inactivation would be impractical."

http://www.epa.gov/ogwdw000/mdbp/pdf/alter/chapt_5.pdf

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## hunter63

> You are welcome to carry PP if you want but that stuff will stain anything it touches including glass. It's also an oxidizer so fires involving it can be pretty intense. And don't mix it with glycerin or alcohol because there will be an explosive reaction! Given the down side of the stuff the up side isn't sufficient for me to carry it. There are other, safer things to do the same things PP will do. It's very good at what it does it's just too dangerous for me.


That's kinda what I was thinking.......I was looking for it and saw the "This is for sale to businesses, and schools, not for sale to private parties".....haz-mat instructions.......Sooooooooo.....Not for me.....not worth the trouble....to me.
Thanks for posting

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## Rick

The problem with it being an oxidizer is if you spill any treated water or it leaks on metal such as knives or firearms it will cause them to rust. The higher the concentration the quicker it will rust.

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## Graf

> You are welcome to carry PP if you want but that stuff will stain anything it touches including glass. It's also an oxidizer so fires involving it can be pretty intense. And don't mix it with glycerin or alcohol because there will be an explosive reaction! Given the down side of the stuff the up side isn't sufficient for me to carry it. There are other, safer things to do the same things PP will do. It's very good at what it does it's just too dangerous for me.


I have started many fires with it without any explosive reation it simply starts smoking then turns into flames, yes the purple staining needs to be considered, but simply washes off hands etc will stain fabris but can also act as distress signal. Bleach used for purifying water can also cause staining, just be careful. Military used PP for years and still refer to it in many survival books. to each there own,agreed.

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## Rick

> Bleach used for purifying water can also cause staining




Does that in the washer, too.  :Blush:  Yeah, I got THE LOOK when the clothes came out.

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## hunter63

So.....does potassium permanganate freeze?....Expand in the heat?.....Leak easily?.

I have a bad habit of putting stuff in pockets/bag/glove boxes/tool boxes and forgetting about them

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## Graf

How i keep mine is in one of those pill casules then seal with thin duct tape to prevent accidental opening, its a powder/granular form. no it doesn't freeze unless mixed with water. No doesn't leak easily either I always open over a sink if indoors if it gets in the sink simply rinse off. i keep a capsule in all my coats during the winter and one in my vehicle all the time, small amounts can provide many water and medcinal purposes. I have drank treated water with out any problems. when mixing for water purifying very slight pink hue, shake it up let it set 30-60 minutes depending on clarity and how cold the water is, same with iodine or bleach. best thing is I have yet to find out the shelf life it seems to be indefinant. i also like the fact that the pink hue lets you know the water has been treated.

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