# Self Sufficiency/Living off the Land or Off the Grid > Livestock and Animal Husbandry >  Chicken questions.

## welderguy

After researching the web and this forum, I still have a few questions that only someone with chicken experience can answer.

 The wife and I are going to get some chickens this weekend, we already decided on what ones for egg production, were going with leghorns.

Now from what I have read they produce an average of 300 eggs a year if the coop is set up with lights , I was not able to find any info on how many they produce if there is no light in the coop. any Ideas .

We are only wanting enough chickens to produce maybe 2 dozen -/+ eggs a week, so from what I have read if they indeed do lay 300 eggs a year with the right conditions all I would need was 3 or 4 chickens to get my dozen a week. sound about right.
Any and all comments and help is appreciated Thanks

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## nell67

Without lights,my chickens lay only about 4 eggs a week right now,and I have about 20 hens,so the production is way down,my daughter in laws mother has about the same number of hens,and her chickens still lay every day.
The lights should be set on a timer to come on about dusk and stay on only long enough to compensate for the lack of sunlight needed,and adjust it as the hours of sunlight increase,in the summer,you will not need the lights at all.

you will have to gather the eggs frequently in the winter to keep them from freezing.

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## RBB

What do I remember about chickens?  Takes 75 to warm a chicken coop enough so you need no other heat source (in Minnesota).  

A light bulb is enough heat source to heat a lesser number of chickens.

You can get by with a lot less feed if you let them range (in summer).

Letting them range subjects them to a lot more predators.

Predators:  Coyote, skunk, dog, mink, fisher, weasel, hawk, marten, owl - polish up your .22 marksmanship.

Egg production depends on a variety of factors:  Heat, cold, age of chicken, change in weather, etc.

I'd get a lot more chickens than you think you need (we always started with  100 chicks) and see how it goes.  You can always eat them if you have too many.

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## RBB

Sorry, Double post.

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## welderguy

> Without lights,my chickens lay only about 4 eggs a week right now,and I have about 20 hens,.


Nell, is that per chicken 4 eggs a week or is that for all 20 per week.

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## nell67

THats for all 20 for the week.

we had chickens  about 6 years ago,and the barn had the light set up and I never noticed much of a reduction in egg numbers at all,except for the normal cycles that the hens go through.

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## Sourdough

Where are you getting your Leghorns.....?  Not to take away from any member advise, but www.McMurrayHatchery.com has been helpful for me. They have a 1-800-# that I can get answers.


For what it is worth, my turkeys and geese all survived three weeks of -20*F and down to -31*F and they have no shelter, no house, no heat, just a chain link enclosure. They have received "NO" water, they eat snow. I feed them and that is all.

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## welderguy

> Where are you getting your Leghorns.....?  Not to take away from any member advise, but www.McMurrayHatchery.com has been helpful for me. They have a 1-800-# that I can get answers.
> 
> 
> For what it is worth, my turkeys and geese all survived three weeks of -20*F and down to -31*F and they have no shelter, no house, no heat, just a chain link enclosure. They have received "NO" water, they eat snow. I feed them and that is all.


From a farm in east texas best price ive found for young ( under 6 monts old)
layers in my area. found the place on a recent hunting trip.

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## welderguy

> THats for all 20 for the week.
> 
> we had chickens  about 6 years ago,and the barn had the light set up and I never noticed much of a reduction in egg numbers at all,except for the normal cycles that the hens go through.


wow, thanks for that info, guess I will have to set up a light and timer.

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## OhioHillbilly

We have been raising Barred Rocks for about 15 years and we've never had lights in the coop. I don't know much about Leghorns other than they are a big breed and good layers.
   In winter we put hot water in their feed and the eggs practrically shoot out of the hens. My great-grandpaw taught me that when I was a little kid.  The only slow time is when they molt and that won't last too long.

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## nell67

Hot water in the feed?? I have never heard of that one,my chickens are still free range,but I am supplementing that with feed now that winter has set on,will have to give that a try and see how it works out!

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## Sourdough

> We have been raising Barred Rocks for about 15 years and we've never had lights in the coop. I don't know much about Leghorns other than they are a big breed and good layers.
>    In winter we put hot water in their feed and the eggs practrically shoot out of the hens. My great-grandpaw taught me that when I was a little kid.  The only slow time is when they molt and that won't last too long.


Thought you were going to say you boil the feed for 3 mins. and they shoot out hard'boiled eggs........ :Stick Out Tongue:  :Stick Out Tongue:  :Stick Out Tongue:  :Smile:  :Smile:

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## welderguy

hopeak, that was funny.
Thanks everyone for all the tips, I really appreciate them

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## A190

I keep a light on a timer for the winter time.  I still get about 15 eggs a week with 30 birds.  Some of the older hens seldom lay now, but I keep them around cause they were my first batch I hatched.

The newer ones, Rock Island and Rhodies  still  lsy well.

Summer time production goes way up

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## wildWoman

I use a wind-up led lantern made by Freeplay. It's timed by how long I wind it up for. Bright enough for 2 out of my 5 ducks; when i tried to see if the lantern really was making a difference and stopped putting it in, the two stopped laying...rather stupid. No fresh eggs now.

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## RunsWithDeer

We have a mixture of hens: barred rocks, leghorns and buffs.  We have 20 birds, and with a light on a timer we are getting 8-12 eggs a day.  We just started with the light in mid December.  We like to give the birds a little rest in egg production, we did not get many eggs Oct-mid Dec.  Some of the hens are getting old and we will get some chicks in the spring, probably barred rocks, they are doing well for us.
Our chicken coop in not well insulated, and it's been pretty cold, below zero the past few days.  So, we have a small electric heater to keep the water from freeezing.

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## wildWoman

If you have snow, a great and easy way to keep them warmer is to just bank snow against the walls, up to roof level if you can.
For off-gridders, another method that works is to heat up a steel bucket of gravel on the wood stove and hang it into the coop overnight.

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## Badawg

I have two auracanas and a barred rock and I cosistantlyaverage 2 eggs a day. I don't use lights or heat as I live far south.

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## Arsey

Totally different climate, I know, but we built a straw bale coop for ours for the winter (it gets below freezing here, Honest!!). 
We didn't get fancy at all, the bales were just stacked tightly, a piece of ply was put in for the roof which then had bales put on it and then the whole lot had a cheap tarp wrapped around it. Made a wire door and Bob was your auntie's brother.
Cheap, easy to make, hens loved it and it was mulch in the spring.

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## nell67

My chickens are playing easter egg hunt with me already,my auracanas have been laying in the loft of the barn,got up there a while ago to pull some strw and hay closer to the opening,and low and behold a nest full of eggs,they play this game too well,most of the eggs were frozen and cracked.

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## Badawg

They are good at that. I found a big clutch under the table saw....

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## welderguy

Here is my chicken update, We did not get our chickens the weekend that we had planned on , but did 2 weeks later we were given 11 hens and one rooster, And our daily egg count is between 2 to six eggs a day average being 3 or 4 . Thats with out a light at current time and feeding all our veggie scraps as well as laying pellets.

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## nell67

My chickens didn't like the pelleted food,they do much better on the crumbless,but I cut that out now because they are still free range and are getting plenty.

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## RunsWithDeer

We keep scratch and pelleted (or crumbles) food available for our chickens at all times.  Mine don't seem to mind if it is pellets or crumbles.  They get the run of the yard now that the weather is nice, helps keep the coop cleaner and we enjoy watching them in the yard.

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## oldtrap59

Was looking through some of these older posts and found this one.Have a couple of comments to make then will be quiet. I have kept chickens for a long time and it seems to me that if you want eggs or meat or both with the least messing around it's a good idea to stick with some of the old or heirloom breeds. Most of these breeds are more duel purpose and probably won't lay as many eggs as some of the new more comercial breeds but they do have alot of good points too. In most cases they'll be bigger and make a better frier if one of your ladies goes broody. (if you have a rooster) Also in many cases your duel purpose breeds are quieter and not so high strung. Will do better under tougher conditions. Over the years I have kept wyndottes,orpingtons,black giants,barred rocks and more others then I'm going to type here. At this time I have a small flock of buttercups and find them to be a nice medium size breed that lay like crazy most of the time. They are allowed some freedom to graze but most of the time they are on a mixed grain feed.( don't use commercial feeds) Some might say I feed a cheap wildbird mix less the sunflower seeds with red wheat and cracked corn added. Hey it works. For those that are thinking of getting a small flock for eggs, go for it and keep an open mind as far as breeds. There's alot of good ones out there that you won't hear about eveyday but they'll darnned sure do the job for ya.

Oldtrap

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## kyratshooter

New Question;

When spring comes I will be building a portable coop/w run.  I expect to keep no more then 6 hens.  How much ground space do I need in the run?  How many nest boxes?   How much room per bird on the roost?

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## oldtrap59

Ky. I have 13 hens right now. My coop is based on a 4'x8' sheet of plywood or 32 sq feet of floor space. I built my nest boxes on the outside for two reasons. One so as to gives the hens more room and also to make it possible to check eggs without going into the coop.( six nests for my bakers dozen hens) My setup has an 8'x8' attached run 3' high and covered on the top with wire. As I have mentioned before I allow my hens some free run time also. Not everyday but at least a couple of times a week. Right now they seem to really enjoy scratching around in whats left of the garden so(Haven't bothered the winter plants yet) I let them do their thing there. I keep the feed tray in the coop and let the water outside as here I don't have to worry about it freezing. As far as roosts go I have three boards across the end away from the door. Gives my hens about 12' of roost which seems to be enough. 

Having some camera problems right now but will post some pics when I can.

Oldtrap

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## ravenscar

if i remember correctly, the city of maimi sells captured chickens.

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## kyratshooter

> if i remember correctly, the city of maimi sells captured chickens.


I'm not going 1200 miles to get chickens.

Thanks OT your discription lets me visualize what you are saying pretty well.  I just want a few eggs and my place is small.  I want to build a portable run/coop I can move with the lawn tractor.

I have been hooked.  Danged "egg pushers".  First they give you a couple of  free range eggs.  Then you come back for a dozen to make a pie.  Before you know it you are walking past the eggs at Kroger as watered down crap and driving across town and into the country for the good stuff!  

I just hope I can start growing my own before I get scrambled up in an egg deal gone bad!  Strange neighborhood, dogs cats and chickens running loose, kids playing in the yard without a guard.  I think I saw a cow hanging around out back.

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## Rick

I once knew a guy that moved his coop with a lawn mower. Once he got the pen moved there wasn't a chicken to be seen. Lot's of feathers floatin' in the air though. Mower ran funny after that, too. Not eggs actly sure why.

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## dottie

Winedots are one of your best all-round chicken whether for laying, meat, or setting, or raising their young, and unlike leghorns who are on the hyper-flighty-fidgety nervous side. The winedots are much more ocile and easily handled by Humans.

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## dottie

When any of my hens do that to me, I end up with 15-20 more chicks.

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## crashdive123

> I once knew a guy that moved his coop with a lawn mower. Once he got the pen moved there wasn't a chicken to be seen. Lot's of feathers floatin' in the air though. Mower ran funny after that, too. Not eggs actly sure why.


He should have turned it in during the cash for cluckers.

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## BH51

Presently I've got a flock of 8 Buff Orpington hens In a pen that could
be moved with a lawn tractor but I would recommend the Production
Red breed, as they were the best layers I've ever had...Takes a rooster
and an incubator for periodic reproduction, however...Note: dis'engage
the blades on the tractor when moving the pen..Ha,ha.......yeah..BH51

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## nell67

> New Question;
> 
> When spring comes I will be building a portable coop/w run. I expect to keep no more then 6 hens. How much ground space do I need in the run? How many nest boxes? How much room per bird on the roost?


I have half the number of nest boxes as I have hens,and usually that is too many,because they all seem to like the same box,even to the point that 2 will be trying to lay in the same nest even though there are plenty of empty nests next door.

If I had a portable run,I would maby have it  6'Lx3' wide,and move it often or they will kill the grass from scratching,I also would water the area I plan to move it to to bring the bugs/worms to the surface,also so they do not have to scratch as much.

The chickens will group together on the roost at night (safety and warmth) so for 6 hens,I would do no more than 10' of roost.

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## crashdive123

If you add a very small amount of dish soap to the water, it will bring out the insects and worms a lot faster.

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## Rick

And they will be pre-cleaned for the chickens.

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## ravenscar

if i biuld a bee hive next to a chicken coop, would they be issues?

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## crashdive123

Do you really want to gather eggs in a bee suit?

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## ravenscar

why not i have to wear a fencing mask to visit my sister

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## Rick

Is she married? If not, I think we have just the guy for her.

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## ravenscar

dont you dare...

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## ravenscar

back to chickens, can they be let loose in a 5 acre semi wooded area and  survive without feed?

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## shiftyer1

I have a dozen of so chickens on total free range they only use maybe a couple acres.  As long as you have grasses, weeds and bugs in those woods your fine.  Chickens will eat anything.  Just keep in mind if they are loose you will spend alot of time practicing for the easter egg hunts.  Mine lay in the coop for a while and then get bored and lay in some crazy spot,  like the back of my truck.

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## Sourdough

Chickens like meat, so any road kill or guts, etc. 

Those "Vile" Turkeys will kill each other and eat the dead bird. 

I have fun watching the ermine (weasels) steal the goose eggs, then roll them up a plank and push them off to crack them. Last winter I accidently hit the wood pile with the plowtruck and 10 ermine exploded everywhere.

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## ravenscar

> I have a dozen of so chickens on total free range they only use maybe a couple acres.  As long as you have grasses, weeds and bugs in those woods your fine.  Chickens will eat anything.  *Just keep in mind if they are loose you will spend alot of time practicing for the easter egg hunts.*  Mine lay in the coop for a while and then get bored and lay in some *crazy spot*,  like the back of my truck.


"huney you start the burn barrel?" 
"yes, you cookin chicken for din?"
"no, why?"

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## amateur survivalist

To answer the original question. I'm in mid Missouri currently running about 25 laying hans of various breeds. I have a leanto set up for chicken house. No lights and get between 7-18 eggs per day. The lights don't affect egg laying as rumored... chickens lay an egg every 25-30 hours depending on breed. Now on that note.... the cold and heat will affect egg laying. In winter they lay less eggs and during summer same as well. As stated in a previous comment they go though a molt stage once a year and in the molting stage you will not get an egg from the ones molting. Also if your raising them for eggs. DO NOT let them sit on the eggs if you get a sitter they go broody and don't lay for about a month.

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## Tootsiepop254

The lights have to be broad spectrum to simulate natural daylight (the same as when force cycling a mare for early breeding)

Sent from my LG-H901 using Tapatalk

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## nell67

> The lights have to be broad spectrum to simulate natural daylight (the same as when force cycling a mare for early breeding)
> 
> Sent from my LG-H901 using Tapatalk


Nope, or at least my hens didn't care that I only used plain old heat lamps or el cheap-o solar powered lights, their eye sight is so poor in dim to no light that any artificial light IS sunlight to them. Takes a few days for it to kick in if you have not used a light and then suddenly add one to the coop.

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## Tootsiepop254

Mine don't even lay if I'm looking at them lol.

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## nell67

> Mine don't even lay if I'm looking at them lol.


 Anal-retentive chickens,LOL. I have seen them walk across the yard, dip down mid stride as if sitting down, deposit an egg and go on about their business.

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## Rick

I've done the same thing a time or two. Mine is an age problem though.

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## ZZSSZ

Hot water in the feed?? I have never heard of that one,my chickens are still free range,but I am supplementing that with feed now that winter has set on,will have to give that a try and see how it works out!

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## JohnLeePettimore

Here's a new subject:

If I let my chickens free-range, they eat all the cat poop in the yard. They seem to go into a feeding frenzy for fresh stuff.

This bothers me on some level, considering that I've heard that eggs will take on the flavor of garlic or onions if you feed the chickens enough of it.

Any comment?

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## LowKey

Maybe it isn't really the cat poop they are eating. 
Checked the cat for worms lately?

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## Alan R McDaniel Jr

I try not to pay too close attention to the feeding habits or farm animals or pets. Free range poultry and swine will eat most anything, including each other.  If the chicken get too close to the hog it happens very fast and permanent.  

On the flip side.  Whenever it was hog killing day the chickens were an absolute menace.  They'd have to be penned up.  

Every now and then #1 son's chickens will run a mouse out of some pile of rubbish and the chase is on.  It doesn't last very long but the all get in on it.

Alan

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## kyratshooter

Don't worry John Lee, they are eating the cat crap to get the taste of the dog crap out of their mouths.

Free range chickens are living on worms, bugs, maggots and they will scavenge dead bodies of anything they find.  It's their nature, they are not born vegans.

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## JohnLeePettimore

> Don't worry John Lee, they are eating the cat crap to get the taste of the dog crap out of their mouths.
> 
> Free range chickens are living on worms, bugs, maggots and they will scavenge dead bodies of anything they find.  It's their nature, they are not born vegans.


I know they eat practically anything, not raw potatoes, though. They will eat COOKED potatoes. Cat crap is great. Raw potatoes are yucky. Go figure.

Anyways, back to the subject. I'm not really worried about it, but I figured I'd mention it. Catfish eat fish crap. Shrimp are bottom feeders, too, and they're great. It all gets processed through the system. Heck, plants "eat" the manure that's put into gardens.

I guess all of us are eating $#! in one way or another..

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## myrtle.rankind

What a beautiful thread! But I still cannot understand what people are discussing here. Anyway looks fine and ridiculous

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## JohnLeePettimore

> What a beautiful thread! But I still cannot understand what people are discussing here. Anyway looks fine and ridiculous


Sometimes minds wander, so you never know where a thread will go.

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## josha

I have a dozen of so chickens on total free range they only use maybe a couple acres. As long as you have grasses, weeds and bugs in those woods your fine. Chickens will eat anything. Apparently they like spam too.

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## nell67

> I have a dozen of so chickens on total free range they only use maybe a couple acres. As long as you have grasses, weeds and bugs in those woods your fine. Chick ens will eat anything. Apparently they like spam too.


they Love spam, Crash.

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## Alan R McDaniel Jr

Spam flavored eggs! Yummmmmmm! My favorite. 

Alan

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## Rick

someone recommended spam sushi. I said, heck yeah. I removed the seaweed, scraped away the rice and ate the spam. It was yummy.

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## madmax

I want chickens.  Kelly's grandma told a hilarious story (when she was still kicking) about her sisters making her crawl under the porch to catch a chicken somebody didn't quite break it's neck. She caught it.  Chopped it. and ate it.

Tough old lady.

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## Rick

I'll bet it wasn't so dang funny to the chicken. It's no doubt fixin' to sue. It's a foul story if ever I heard one. Have you had your neck rung? You might be entitled to compensation. We'll get you all the money you deserve not just a poultry sum. 

Guests can not see images in the messages. Please register in the forum.

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## kyratshooter

When I was a kid we would kill 50-100 chickens at a time.  Grandad would have three or four running around the yard headless at the same time.

I remember Mom wringing one's neck once and it started flapping.  She gave it a toss and it flew 50 yards before it hit the ground!

Big tub of hot water and the smell of wet feathers.  Pluck them, singe off the pin feathers with rolled up newspaper.  Gut them and drop them in a plastic bag and tie it with a twist tie for the freezer.  It was quite a ritual.  

Then there would be a supper of livers, hearts and gizzards.  I never did like chicken innards.  Could not stand the mushy texture.

BTW, there has not been a cooked or raw chicken available at any store locally for more than a week.  Frozen is still available but no fresh birds.

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## madmax

One of my dad's friends had chickens.  We liked to go feed them.  They were less stinky than the hogs.  Not by much though.  My little brother had a tough time with the killing.  Dad's friend said, "You've watched them chickens kill and eat everything that moves.  Imagine you're 1 inch tall and that chicken was 6 foot tall.  You think it would hesitate to peck and eat you?".  Whole new perspective.

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## WolfVanZandt

I don't know what they're selling for chicken in stores. We call it pterodactyl. The breasts are huge and the meat is often rubbery. But, biologically, chickens aren't that far from dinosaurs anyway. Yes, they would happily eat you.

My father raised chickens for awhile but we didn't eat them. They were show chickens. (There's a pun there, somewhere.)

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## madmax

I heard the store turkeys were to fat to ....  They grow them just to eat.  So much for the 
natural scheme of things.

I like fried turkey legs.

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## Michael aka Mac

Rick, I am just like you, but opposite.  I grab the spam sushi, push the spam out the middle and put in its place eel...Yummy

I am actually not a huge spam fan. I have eaten it, and I probably have a couple cans of low sodium/fat spam around here somewhere for emergency food, but I am not a lover. Not to mention as I have gotten older so have my dietary restrictions when it comes to fat and sodium.  Even their lower fat and sodium spam is still too high in both.

I personally have never raised chickens. Down the hill from where I lived when I was a kid there was this old ex Army senior citizen that had laying hens and he would sell to all of us, eggs. He was one of the original Army engineers that worked on the nuclear bombs that were dropped on Hiroshima and Nagasaki.  Years later he was in the news for saving one of my relatives life from a Pitbull.  Can't even begin to count in how many ways this guy was a hero.

Come to think of it, I never saw him eat chicken,  but he did like spam.

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## Deimos

> Rick, I am just like you, but opposite.  I grab the spam sushi, push the spam out the middle and put in its place eel...Yummy
> 
> I am actually not a huge spam fan. I have eaten it, and I probably have a couple cans of low sodium/fat spam around here somewhere for emergency food, but I am not a lover. Not to mention as I have gotten older so have my dietary restrictions when it comes to fat and sodium.  Even their lower fat and sodium spam is still too high in both.
> 
> I personally have never raised chickens. Down the hill from where I lived when I was a kid there was this old ex Army senior citizen that had laying hens and he would sell to all of us, eggs. He was one of the original Army engineers that worked on the nuclear bombs that were dropped on Hiroshima and Nagasaki.  Years later he was in the news for saving one of my relatives life from a Pitbull.  Can't even begin to count in how many ways this guy was a hero.
> 
> Come to think of it, I never saw him eat chicken,  but he did like spam.


Maybe you should try fried SPAM, when you decide to eat it. I even go as far as eating fried SPAM along with fried cheese and scrambled eggs.

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## VnVet

Where we live, there are no chickens in our future because the bears, bobcats, coyotes and raccoons all love chicken.. :lool: 

When I was a kid, we had chickens removing their heads makes cleaning them a lot easier.. When a hen quit laying, we had chewy chicken soup.

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## kyratshooter

I gave up on chickens due to predators also.  

I actually had a coyote run out of the fence row, grab a chicken about three meters from me, and run off the opposite side of the lawn with the thing still flapping its feathers.  It was out of sight before I could get my pistol out of the holster!

I had a war with raccoons and coyotes for two years. I learned a lot about the new light vision, infrared scope and motion sensor technology in the process.  Even that could not save the flock.

I had the motion sensor go off one night at 3am and scanned the coop at the bottom of the lot with the night vision scope.  There were a half dozen raccoons on the chicken coop (the run had overhead wire),  three coyotes waiting for them to figure out how to open the gate, and a possum creeping in from the other side. 

I lost from about 3 dozen down to a single hen.  I gave her away to a new raiser and wished them luck.

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## WolfVanZandt

Well, Kentucky /is/ the center of the universe.

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## VnVet

kyratshooter,
We wanted to have chickens; however, your and the experience of others convinced us it would be a war and a losing one. 

Raccoons can be stupid as they ripped open a new bag of smoking pellets and ate them. That dry wood expanding in their stomach?
Coyotes are smarter. We feed the birds who drop a lot of seed and field mice ate the seeds. Two coyotes came and they'd jump up and drop; next lower their head and start chewing. Now, doves come and eat the seed.

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