# General > General Guns & Ammo >  If you had to pick one of these? Ruger1022,Savage Stevens .308, or Maverick88 12ga??

## EarthRocks

*If you had to pick one of these? Ruger1022,Savage Stevens .308, or Maverick88 12ga??*
Need some help deciding on my first rifle purchase.  I think of shtf scenerios, home defense, and hunting. Currently working with about $400 and have done lots of reasearch on what I want and these are the three options I am looking at.

.308 option: Savage-Stevens 200 .308  around $320
.22lr option: Ruger 10/22 Talo tactical rifle around $300
12 ga option: Maverick 88 8shot  around $200

I want something that will be affordable, reliable and useful in any situation.  Even though I really want the stevens .308 for big game right now I am leaning towards the ruger 10/22 since its lighter and would be able to take down most game I would encounter in the urban environment I currently reside.  Plus the .22 is semiauto and has a high capacity mag where the .308 at MY current price range is bolt action and 4 round mag.  

Then there is the 12 ga that is simple and $100 less.

 I already own a .40 s&w as my side arm. 

 Also if there is another reccomendation in my price range that would suite me better Im open to suggestions.
Any insight would be greatly apprecaited.

----------


## kyratshooter

Did we do this one yesterday or the day before, or was it last week?

Just remember that you can kill with the shotgun anything you can with both the 10/22 or the .308.  Small game with shot, large game with slugs and personal defense with buckshot.

I have known folks that went through life with nothing but a shotgun and did just fine.  

I would be the first to say you should have all three, but the shotgun will make a good all around choice while you fill the gaps.

----------


## RandyRhoads

Ruger 10/22. You can do just about anything you could imagine to them. Including putting two together and turning them into a gattling gun with a kit from cabelas. Amazingly cheap to shoot. And extremely accurate with a match grade barrel.

----------


## EarthRocks

Thanks for the recap. I will look for the other forum talking about this topic.

----------


## EarthRocks

A gattling gun .22??  for real?  That is very interesting and I agree with the cheap to shoot as well.  Thanks

----------


## RandyRhoads

Youtube it. I would buy the kit from cabelas if it was legal in my state. Not that a .22 is very intimidating, but I think a gattling gun made of 2 pumping out rounds could fend off a burglar in your house haha.

----------


## EarthRocks

haha I would agree Not intimidating. But I do like the fact of being able to pump out so many shots in so little time, also with great accuracy since no recoil.  thanks

----------


## natertot

I agree with KY. I'd go with a 12ga, but I prefer a Remington 870. You can get those used for about $250 and they are nearly undestructable. A buddy of mine had a Mav88 and it was just about the sloppiest thing I have ever held. I don't ahve any other experience with the Mav88 other than that. I do own 4 870 though, the oldest made in 1957 and still has all original parts. I would stake my life on them day in and day out. 

This is just my opinion based upon my experience.

----------


## EarthRocks

Thank for the heads up about the mav88, i knew it was affordable but didnt know what to think of quality for long term use. Will keep eye out for 870 prices

----------


## natertot

> Thank for the heads up about the mav88, i knew it was affordable but didnt know what to think of quality for long term use. Will keep eye out for 870 prices


The maverick 88 is the same as a mossberg 500 for the most part. They just used alot of lower quality parts to make it cheaper and thus more affordable.

I would look for a Rem 870, a mossberg 500, or a mossberg 590. All three can be had for $200-$275 used in varying conditions. I prefer the 870, but nothing wrong with the mossys either.

----------


## RandyRhoads

The M500 is better than the maverick. I can't remember what exactly it was but the mav had something ( I think the slide tube) that was all molded plastic that couldn't be changed. My  M500 has never failed me.

----------


## EarthRocks

Yea i seen that mossberg made the mavericks at the lower priced and figured something was less quality. The mossberg 590 with ghost sights is a beauty

----------


## Rick

You need to decide What you want your weapon to do. You listed a lot of things but what is you primary need and when will you use it.If funds are limited then buy the tool you need the most. What SHTF scenario are you thinking about? Define your need first then select a tool that will fulfill that need. So far you've said you want a tool to do everything. You won't find that.

There is nothing wrong with the Maverick. I have an 8 shot Security 88 and love it. Most Mossberg accessories fit the Maverick.

----------


## EarthRocks

Thanks for the slap to reality rick... You have found my problem in deciding which I want.  They all have pros and cons.  I guess what i want out my first rifle is home defense and ability to hunt small to medium game.  Im in Colorado but originally from new mexico so thats the only size  game i would need I figure.  My SHTF scenerio would be just where my home was in more danger then usual or having to travel through a city environment while in some sort of chaos.  SOmething light enough that Its not too much of a hasssle to carry for hundreds of miles but powerful enough to make hunting easier.  I have a .40 cal sigma for personal defense once out of a house. Just wondering which of these would be best to purchase first since I would eventually want all three, which would be the best to have from the beginning?  Hope this helps clear my question up.

----------


## Rick

Why wouldn't your .40 be a home defense weapon. Using a weapon inside is a lot different than outside. Hallways and doorways are restricting to a long gun. You need something shorter and something that won't breach your wall and your neighbor's. Hunting small game is a completely different set of requirements.

----------


## EarthRocks

.40 is definately home defense.  So that narrows it down to a rifle for hunting small to medium size game. the shotgun or .308 can handle all size of game but for carrying on long distances with ammo would the power be worth the extra weight over the 1022?

----------


## Rick

If you primary role is small game then I'd go with a 12 gauge. You can hunt birds and fur bearers up to deer. You won't carry as much ammo but why do you need to carry a lot?

----------


## Wildthang

If I could only have 1 gun, it would be a .22. It will defend the home, cheap to shoot, and can take down deer as long as you know where to hit them. Stockpiling ammo is dirt cheap as well. Get the .22 for now, and the shotgun whenever you can afford it. In an urban environment, a .308 would likely kill neighbors along with the bad guys!

----------


## NightShade

Shotgun is the most versatile gun you listed.  Personally, of the guns you listed I wouldn't buy any of them.

Regardless of what people say, a .22 is not the ultimate gun.
Sure you could kill a deer or use it for home defense.  I could also dig a 6x6 trench with a spoon... Doesn't mean it's the right tool.

----------


## Rick

Think more in terms of what you can use today unless you want to set it in the safe and wait for SHTF. Don't even worry about that when spending limited funds. Buy for what you will use it for now. S may never HTF and if it does you will have to adapt no matter what you have. Obviously, different opinions abound but I would not try to take any large game with 22 nor would I want it for home defense. You can do it but what if you aren't successful? That .40 is a starting point just compliment it.

----------


## kyratshooter

I am changing my recomendation!!!!

This is a survivalist named LIZ!!!!

I take it that means we are dealing with a she/female type person.  Nothing wrong with that in the slighest, except that I wish to change my recomendation from 12 guage to 20 guage.  I know very few women that enjoy shooting a 12.  Heck, I don't even enjoy shooting a 12!

Cheap shooting is not always the answer to everything.  Effecient shooting is key.  The .22 covers all the requirements of survival only in ones imagination and/or under perfect conditions.  Those perfect conditions, or even the less perfect ones, seldom include the need for a gattling gun.

----------


## Aurelius95

> That .40 is a starting point just compliment it.


"Ms .40, you sure are a good looking weapon."  Like that, Rick?

----------


## hunter63

Life List...... from 1-to-100, not counting what you have.

1. Shotgun 12 or 20 ga.

2. 22 lr...if you drop the tactical price is 1/3 less..$200 bucks

3. 308 (or any long shooting hunting rifle)

4. thru 99 whole lots of other guns.

100 Cabelas Gatling gun made with 2 Ruger 10/22's plus $400 buck worth of stuff to mount them on.....lots of ammo, some noise, fun but little else........

----------


## hunter63

Just  thought.....you might want ot check out some gun shows......as they have tables of older .22 bolt guns, single shots, auto loaders, in OK condition for $60 to 100 bucks.
Older off brand shotguns, 12, 20, and even a few .16 and .410 not too old, but can be had for $75 to $200 bucks.
Same with bolt rifles/lever guns in hunting calibers, $200 up.......

Now that being said, these are just old fashion hunting, barn and back door guns,..... not tactical, cool, camoed, so might not work for your uses.

I just looked over a collection of these that belonged to a friend that has just passed, along with a dealer friend.......will have several "Table guns' for sale in the $50 to $100 buck range.....Including a sorta rusted Nobel Model 60 12 ga pump...several/lots of .22's and a couple of .410 ga SS and bolt guns.

----------


## Rick

Just like that!

----------


## CoryD

ok, I was brought up on using a 22 for small game. Have never used a shotgun for hunting. with a 22, you pretty much take a head shot ot nothing at all. point is, hunting w/ a 22 is fun, but not all that easy. 
Seeing as I dont know what your skill level with a firearm is, (you may have the skill set of a USMC sniper or... not) Id have to agree with Ky and go with the 20 ga shotgun. more margin for error, and better chance of a clean kill with small game. 
Im not sure why you'd want a 308 in town, unless you want to shoot attackers 6 blocks away. 308 on small game wont leave any meat for ya.

----------


## vahtryn

If I were going to go for the shot gun I'd spend a bit more than 200 bucks and get an 870 for about 350.  Or a Mossberg for about 400.

----------


## lucznik

This is the second time today I am agreeing with Rick.   Just typing that sentence caused my fingers to bleed !!!!

The .40 will do fine for your self-defense needs, home and abroad.  Now you need to decide which of the guns you are wanting is going to literally give you the most "bang for the buck." (pun intended)

Shotguns are nice, but they're expensive to shoot regularly.  Even "cheap" shells add up fast when you consider you only get, at most, 25 shells per box - sometimes less. So too the .308.  Of course, if you're going to be a big-game hunter, you'll need one or the other. 

The .22 is a lot cheaper to shoot and you will become a far better marksman shooting brick after brick of cheap .22 LRs and learning to perfect your fundamentals than you ever will shooting a center-fire gun. The .22 is also a fabulous small game hunting firearm.  

If you do decide on the .308, you might want to look at the Remington m700 - which I know can be had at Walmart for under $400.  Also, Ruger is right now coming out with a new "All American" rifle that has a MSRP of under $440 and that will almost certainly sell for less in stores.  It's supposed to be scheduled to ship to stores in mid-January.  They both would be worth at least a look before you settle on the Savage/Stevens.

----------


## natertot

I'd go with a 12ga, 28" inch barrel with screw in chokes. This will allow perfectly for all game from a squirrel to a deer. Use the .40 for HD. As Rick said, long arms suck inside.

----------


## natertot

> If I were going to go for the shot gun I'd spend a bit more than 200 bucks and get an 870 for about 350.  Or a Mossberg for about 400.


An 870 for $350? You are over paying my friend!

----------


## Winter

The 10/22. You can buy it, a few mags, and 1000 rounds of ammo. As a rifleman, i never support a shotgun as multiuse. It's multiuse like a spork; it's still a spoon trying to be a fork.

----------


## tank

I really think you can do better on the prices. A friend of mine just bought a Ruger 10/22 at wally world for 217.95 out the door. shop around , don't buy the first gun you see. their are alot of guns out there.

----------


## EarthRocks

Thank everyone on their opinions so far.  with your help I have been able to put a lil more info on what i want to get.
  To make it clear I am a male college student and work , but I just make enough to pay bills usually. I recently won a 3D animation contest here in denver for $1000 this is how i have a lil extra cash for a new weapon.(after paying some bills)  so money is a issue if i want to be able topractice at the range continously and load up on ammo.  So out of the recommedations I am leaning towards the .22 simply because of the cost of ammo, and rifle.  Glad to be reassured that my 40 will do fine for hd or abroad.  Also the facts of how each gun is and can be used is extremely useful.  
The .308 is looking out of place in the city from what ive learned, i mainly saw it as very useful if out of the city so it is not going to get much use for now.  Also more expensive for ammo and scope. so thanks to you all I can put this on my wishlist for later. 
The shot gun seems ideal for my situation as well but the ammo prices will get costly if I go to a range often.  And hope this first rifle can help me get better with rifles as I have with pistols. And from this post it looks like the .22 matches. with the 12 ga right behind. for the next purchase asap

----------


## EarthRocks

I was recommened to state my areas of location so it would be easier for advice.  I reside in the state of colorado and new mexico since i am a student traveling is a huge issue for multiple reasons.  this is why I think of weight and ability carry ammo with me as a factor. If traveling on foot id want to be able to carry as much ammo as possible as ive said before.

----------


## Winter

Another advantage of the .22, in your situation, is you can afford to practice with it. This is very important.

----------


## TresMon

If you travel a lot and always want to have it with you, you might look at a Marlin Papoose .22.
Now some folks will try to sway you towards a Henry survival rifle, but they are far inferior. 
 I have worked on Henry's till I'm blue in the face in my gunsmithing business. I turn them away as a rule anymore.

http://www.marlinfirearms.com/firear...ding/70pss.asp

----------


## natertot

Sounds like a .22 would be better for your overall situation. .22 Rifle was my first gun and they can be versatile. Don't limit yourself to the Ruger 10/22 either. 10/22 is a fine rifle, but I will not own another one. I hate that the bolt doesn't lock to the rear and you can't drop the mag with your dominate hand while bringing up a new mag with your non-dominate hand. This really kills on reloading during compition as well as speed shooting. 

Due to the above, I went with a Remington 597. It was my first rifle and had to sell when things got tough. When things got better, I got the 10/22 and disliked which prompted me to trade it straight across for another 597. It is reliable and accurate, no doubt. but not as accurate as a 597 IMO plus I can reload quicker with the 597. The 597 also has the bolt stop which is common on most rifles. This way when you move up to a larger cal semi-auto, you will already be acquainted with the same features. 

Other than the 10/22 and 597, are there any other .22 Semi-Auto rifles any one would like to recommend?

----------


## TresMon

> Other than the 10/22 and 597, are there any other .22 Semi-Auto rifles any one would like to recommend?


See my above...

----------


## SARKY

If this is your first firearm and you are fairly new to firearms, Get the 10-22! Very little recoil (no acquiring of bad/flinch habits), ammo is cheap (which means you can shoot a lot). These both add up to not just "practice makes perfect" but "perfect practice make perfect"
Lastly the 10-22 cam be highly modified and accurized .

----------


## Rick

Then look for a good used 10/22. You'll save some money and still have a great firearm.

----------


## lucznik

> ...the Ruger 10/22 either. 10/22 is a fine rifle, but I will not own another one. I hate that the bolt doesn't lock to the rear and you can't drop the mag with your dominate hand while bringing up a new mag with your non-dominate hand. This really kills on reloading during compition as well as speed shooting. 
> 
> Due to the above, I went with a Remington 597... [because] I can reload quicker with the 597. The 597 also has the bolt stop which is common on most rifles.


Not arguing with what you've posted here but, I just wanted to point out that these two things would never have occurred to me to care or even think about. Well, maybe I would have thought about the bolt staying open after the last shot but, it sure wouldn't be an absolute deal breaker.  I use my 22s for plinking and small game hunting.  Fast reloads just aren't an issue; nor really, is an open bolt after the last shot. 

If I were recommending a 22 rifle to someone I would never have thought to consider these issues but, if the purchaser was intending to use the gun in competition, he'd likely have been poorly served by my advise.  On the other hand, if he's going to use the gun more like I do, then putting too much emphasis on unnecessary features could also result in being steered the "wrong" way.  

This just goes to illustrate that you need to evaluate the proposed gun purchase for the things YOU are going to want to do with the gun, not for what others use their guns.

As an aside, I like the Ruger but, I think of it more as a gun for people who plan on investing in a bunch of modifications.  As it comes from the factory, at least with the ones I've owned/used, the wood stock is overly large, the trigger is horrible, and the sights (especially if you get one that has the fiber optic front post) leave much to be desired.  Fixing these issues costs more $$$.   

I would buy one again but, I would know going into it that it would need work.

----------


## natertot

Lucznik, you are abosolutely right. The Rem 597, I find, is good to go out of the box. The 10/22 needs mods out the wazoo. I like the features mentioned because when you step up to a semi-auto center fire, they have those same features. When he decides to up to a SKS, AK, AR, M1, etc, he will already be accustomed to the bolt locking back and dropping mags with one hand and reloading with the other. As a shooter, I find things to be commonplace and don't buy firearms that are not typical feature wise. It just makes transitioning from one to another that much easier. Not to mention brand new, the 597 is $20 cheaper then the 10/22 and shoots very well out of the box without mods. JMHO when your trying to be thrifty.

----------


## oldtrap59

Does anyone here recall the Marlin Mod. 60? Plus's Good out of the box, cheap, tough, light weight.Minus's In my book none. I have two of them and the older one(40+ years) still has all it's parts like it came out of the box.

Oldtrap

----------


## crashdive123

Another 22 rifle to look at - and a lot of folks here have/had one - is the Marlin Model 60.

*Edit:*  Oops.  Missed your post oldtrap59.

----------


## CoryD

Marlin  also has the 795, a detatchable mag version of the 60, and the 39a. Henrys survival rifle may not be the greatest, but thier levers arent too bad. Savage also has a line if 22s. Ive heard Mossbergs were soso/ok...There CZs if you want a nicer bolt action ( these kinda have a rep as a nice shooter), and rugers 77/22.... and there Cricket/Chipmunk, nice little rifle for kids, but they make an adult size iirc...single shot bolt action that one. They're 22s...buy one of each  :Laugh:

----------


## TresMon

You can shut down any gun debate by saying "the best gun is the closest one when you really need it fast!!"


He he he snicker snicker ha

----------


## Winter

> Then look for a good used 10/22. You'll save some money and still have a great firearm.


you know Rick, in my time working pawn shops and gun stores, I've never seen someone selling a used 10/22. Hmmmm..

----------


## SARKY

Both of my 10-22s were bought used $40 each. One was from a friend and it looked like it was brand new. The other from a gun shop and the stock was pretty beat up but the action and bore were good. Both have been highly modified to my specs. 
Point of fact, you can get a mag release that will allow you to dump the mag with your dominate/trigger hand. As to the bolt not staying open after the last round.....My HK-91 does the same thing practice, practice, practice and it won't make that big a difference. Some of you have gotten soft and lazy with all the advances in firearms. If you were a lever gun guy or gal, you would know when you ran out of ammo when you dropped the hammer and it went click! Learn your weapon and adapt!!!

----------


## crashdive123

> ..............Some of you have gotten soft and lazy with all the advances in firearms. If you were a lever gun guy or gal, you would know when you ran out of ammo when you dropped the hammer and it went click! Learn your weapon and adapt!!!


While we don't see it here on this forum, it seems that so many "survivalist" types are learning their firearms tactics and practice from an XBox 360, Nintendo, or Game Boy where their bullet count is displayed on the screen.

----------


## natertot

> Point of fact, you can get a mag release that will allow you to dump the mag with your dominate/trigger hand. As to the bolt not staying open after the last round.....My HK-91 does the same thing practice, practice, practice and it won't make that big a difference. Some of you have gotten soft and lazy with all the advances in firearms. If you were a lever gun guy or gal, you would know when you ran out of ammo when you dropped the hammer and it went click! Learn your weapon and adapt!!!


Once again, you have to modify it! The 597 you don't. I don't wan't to pay $20 more for a gun and mofidy the crap out of it to do what another gun will do for $20 less out of the box. To me that just is not good logic. If I found a 10/22 for $40, I'd probly buy it just cause myself. As far as firearm advances, the bolt of a M1 Garand locks back after the last shot and I'm pretty sure that was designed well before your HK-91. I also like the bolt locking to the rear after the last shot because that is what an overwhelming majority of semi-autos do. This way when I switch from one to another, the fundamentals are the same. It also requires less motion on the reload. I only have to bump the bolt rearward to put a new round into the chamber in stead of pulling a bolt three inches. Makes things a little quicker, ya know.

----------


## sh4d0wm4573ri7

Sorry I am of biased opinion. I have since age 21 or so been a confirmed 12 gauge guru. I purchased a used Remington 870 the year I got married. I have hunted everything available with it It is my camp gun it goes wherever I go rain shine snow heat cold mud you name it it's been through it for 29 years worth give or take. In all this time with all these variables when I pull this trigger this gun goes bang everytime!

----------


## natertot

> Sorry I am of biased opinion. I have since age 21 or so been a confirmed 12 gauge guru. I purchased a used Remington 870 the year I got married. I have hunted everything available with it It is my camp gun it goes wherever I go rain shine snow heat cold mud you name it it's been through it for 29 years worth give or take. In all this time with all these variables when I pull this trigger this gun goes bang everytime!


I agree with you 100% This fellow want's to shoot a lot and carry alot of ammo though. 12ga rounds are a bit pricier, and heavier, and take up more room. Because he is a college student with limited funds, the .22 would be better suited for his overall desires. 

I believe in the 12ga, especially the 870. I own four of them, one of which is 55 years old, and they always work without fail!

----------


## lucznik

> I have since age 21 or so been a confirmed 12 gauge guru. I purchased a used Remington 870 the year I got married. I have hunted everything available with it It is my camp gun it goes wherever I go rain shine snow heat cold mud you name it it's been through it for 29 years worth give or take. In all this time with all these variables when I pull this trigger this gun goes bang everytime!


Not sure you quite understand the meaning of the word "guru."

A guru is a person who is regarded (by others) as having great knowledge, wisdom, and authority in a given area. You can rightfully self claim to be an "enthusiast," "aficionado," "devotee," "fan," "fanatic," addict," "adherent," "admirer," or "buff" but only others will decide if you are a "guru."  It is not a title one takes upon them-self.

----------


## hunter63

When faced with this dilemma, just do what I do....buy one of each and try them out, of course this might not be a option for everyone.
But at least you will know what you like....they make brand news .22's everyday, different kinds for different folks.

----------


## lucznik

> ...they make brand news .22's everyday...


  Speaking of this, did you see that Ruger has come out with a new .22lr pistol?  

http://www.ruger.com/products/sr22Pistol/index.html?r=y

I want one!

----------


## Rick

Dues this mean I have to remove "guru of the universe" from my resume? I really like that title.

----------


## lucznik

No, because we gave you that title.  It wasn't self-proclaimed.

----------


## SARKY

Just found a bolt hold open device for the 10-22. YES I know it is an accessory but it solves one of the problems some have with the 10-22. Understand, the 597 came out well after the 10-22. As such they incorporated all these goodies in this model. Their older models don't have those modifications.

----------


## hunter63

> Speaking of this, did you see that Ruger has come out with a new .22lr pistol?  
> 
> http://www.ruger.com/products/sr22Pistol/index.html?r=y
> 
> I want one!


Yeah, saw them, not really into the new style 'tack" stuff, much.....Besides how many .22's can you use....(Did I just say THAT?)

I'll probably win one at our DU Dinner anyway...........

They are cool looking though, I'll give ya that.

----------


## Otis

So to add to the banter as a new guy here on the forum, I am going to go with a different direction. I see the question all the time on other forums out there but the answer really depends on what the SHTF senerio is. In my opinion if the S really HTF there would be all sorts of things going on. If you alrady have a self defence gun, you are good for the short run but eventually there is going to be shortages on everything, especailly ammo. That will probably go first. That beaing said, I dont think people put enough emphasis on pellet guns. If you get a good quality variable pump pellet gun that may be your best friend and eventually be the sole supplier of food for your family. The propellent is free, i.e. air and the ammo is small and cheap and would not be unreasonable to have 1000's of rounds stocked up. Even then if you do run out, far easier to produce than a bullet of any caliber. 

Aside from that, I would go with the .22 for all the reasons already posted. lots of practice time, ammo is cheap, can hunt various things and a heck of a good time. I have 2 10-22's and got them both used for under $100. Put several thousand rounds through each and never a problem. Keep looking and you will find them. 

Otis

----------


## Rick

Wait. What? There are other forums? Next you'll be telling us you can't trust everything you read on the internet.

And stop posting the gun porn. You got me all excited over that .22.

----------


## EarthRocks

hahaha thanks again everyone for all the information.

----------


## hunter63

> hahaha thanks again everyone for all the information.


Yeah, we tend to get off on tangents....so did you make up your mind......?

----------


## EarthRocks

yes.  I will be going with a* 10/22*  or other .22lr to help my over all shooting since it is so inexpensive on ammo and wont encourage flinching while shooting often, which I want to do. Hunting or practice.  I will get the* 12ga* next and a nice* .308* once I get a better job.  Over all the *.22lr* seems to fit my needs also since it is light, semi-auto, and easy to carry mass amount of ammo.  And even though I would like to make myself think I need a *.308* powerhouse, I know a *.22* can do alot in a worst case scenerio, humane or not.  

Thanks again for all the help I received.  The tangents are why I like  about this place!  The more opinions I get to read the better thought out my ideas are.  Also It helps bring out great points of each side to really let me know what will suit me best for the time being.  I will be making my purchase soon.

----------


## Rick

Pics or it didn't happen.

----------


## EarthRocks

Oh I will post pics as soon as I get it.  I found one really close to home but have to help my brother with his rent this month :Frown:   Its guna be smarter for me to wait ONE MORE MONTH! just incase I need to help my bro out with his side of rent)  just found out yesterday by lil bro.  BUT if he has his rent a new member of my family will be coming home ASAP.  WITH PICS!  haha

----------


## SARKY

I would never say that you don't need a .308 or a 12ga, What I am saying is that for a first gun, you can't go wrong with a 10-22.

----------


## EarthRocks

thats all i meant as well.  Im going with the 10-22 for my FIRST longgun and work my way up.  Thanks man

----------


## Rick

I do suggest you change out the magazine release at your first opportunity. It's the one thing I did not like about mine. It's an easy change and not very expensive and makes a lot of difference.

----------


## randyt

Have you tried out the 10-22? If you can trying out a few different models may be beneficial. I bought a remington 510 many years ago and it is still my go to 22 rifle. This comes from a fella with three 10-22s. You can't go wrong with a 10-22 though.

Rick, do you have any links or whatnot on the mag release?

----------


## Topsblades

A couple of things to think about...

First the Ruger 10/22 is now the Ruger 25/22!  The new 25 round Ruger magazines are flawless in my stock Ruger 10/22.  I have the "youth" model with a perfect 16" barrel and the slightly shorter stock.  I had an older Choate Folding stock and it fits it like a glove.  So now I have a reliable, accurate and compact .22 that can put a lot of ammo on target in a short period of time.  The stock barrel is fine and the red/green fiber optic sights are really good.

If someone is going for their first or one of their first firearms I think it should be something that they will shoot and shoot a lot.  .22 is easy on the pocketbook and the shoulder, not to mention just plain fun.

I won't replace my Remington 870 for home defense.  I won't replace my Springfield EMP for EDC and I won't replace my Marlin 30-30 for Alabama Whitetail.  But if I was buying my first firearm, of the three listed I would choose the Ruger hands down.  Start there and then work up to the 12 (or 20) gauge and then the 308.

----------


## Rick

I just read the extended mag release is now standard. If you want to retrofit try:

http://ruger10-22magrelease.com/

If that's not the one I put in mine it's pretty close. Here's a vid on the change out

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BBlOKGHiGPw

----------


## randyt

thanks for the links Rick.  I may retrofit one of mine.

----------


## Rick

Randy, they make one that's super long and follows the trigger guard. Mine is the smaller and the long one wasn't available when I changed mine so I don't know how they function. But there are several different kinds on the market.



Guests can not see images in the messages. Please register in the forum.

----------


## randyt

That's quite a rig but I wonder if a extended mag release is needed for me. The 10-22 is a one of those firearms that a guy loads on sunday and shoots all week LOL. if ten shots don't do it changing a mag in a hurry probably won't matter much. I'm going to ponder this. I'll probably give one a try.

----------


## Rick

Oh, sure. You just wait. A zombie apocalypse will pop up then you'll wish you could speed change them.

----------


## 2dumb2kwit

> Oh, sure. You just wait. A zombie apocalypse will pop up then you'll wish you could speed change them.


 Not if you have a PSL, and shoot 'em all at 600+ yards.

Just sayin'. LOL

----------


## randyt

> Oh, sure. You just wait. A zombie apocalypse will pop up then you'll wish you could speed change them.


I didn't think of that, that will happen one of these days, it's not a matter of if, it's a matter of when, LOL. thanks Rick

----------


## lucznik

> Oh, sure. You just wait. A zombie apocalypse will pop up then you'll wish you could speed change them.



You know, just as an aside...  I don't really understand what all the fuss over the "Zombie Apocalypse" is all about.  We experience it every morning when we wake our kids up for school and, while irritating, it's really not all THAT bad.

----------


## hunter63

"Oh, Honey,..... these guys on the interweb says, I NEED these cool speed mag changer handles thingies for all the 10/22's.....you know Just In Case"

----------


## Rick

Your kids are still too young. They don't start eating your brains until they learn to drive.

----------


## 2dumb2kwit

> Your kids are still too young. They don't start eating your brains until they learn to drive.


 You're just all smug, 'cus at your age you don't have enough neurons left firing to attract any attention. LOL :Tt2:

----------


## EarthRocks

Thanks for the post rick, this looks to be alot better then the release that comes stock.

----------


## Thaddius Bickerton

Of all the calibers out there, I would venture to say that more people shoot a 22LR than any other the most.

I bought my youngest brother a 10/22 rifle many years ago when he turned 13  (he's 40 now lol) and it was one of the most accurate 22LR's I had shot.

I still have my old mossberg target 22LR bolt action, that while heavy is my favorite "squirrel rifle" along with my flintlock .32 caliber.

As far as the mavrick 88's go they are basically a mossberg 500 with synthetic stock. My oldest son loves the short barreled one that holds 6 + 1 in the chamber with about a 18.5 inch barrel.  It rides in his weld truck or when he is out around the woods more than most of his other weapons. (well that plus some kind of revolver of the moment).  

A 12 gauge is one of the most flexable of firearms out there.  Not only bird shot, slugs, and buckshot, but also there are the short "tacticool rounds" with lower recoil.  We have reloaded some of these with small shot for hunting squirrels and rabbits etc.  (Remember migratory waterfowl the shotty can only hold 3 shells total and the magazine needs a "plug" to restrict it to only 2 shells, plus the one in the chamber.  These are easy to put in and remove as needed.)

As for number of shells vs. weight, 25 shells of mixed types is plenty for a long woods loaf.  Come the zombie apocalypse maybe more might be desired, but I plan on just sitting as much of that out as I can unless they come to me at my homestead.

For a shotty I strongly reccommend mossy (mavrick) or remington pump.  

(Having said that I usually use my old Double 12 that I shortened, added express sights and use Brass shotshells loaded up with slugs to play that I have a double rifle for hog and deer hunting here in Alabama.)

For a long range weapon capable of taking game up to moose and elk, nothing more than a .308 or 30 06 is necessary, and there are any number of other options.

As a fan of military surplus bolt action rifles I really love the 03A3 springfields in 30 06, but for economy nothing beats a Mosin Nagant in 7.62 x 54R.  It gives similar ballistics and cost runs around $100 for one.  For a bit more one can obtain a mauser in 8mm or a SMLE in .303 british that also are fine with hunting bullets for any game up to moose / elk size.  More than fine for deer etc, and all are solid 500 yard performers with tweaking.

A search for military surplus or Curio & Relic firearms will link you to any number of  companies that sell military surplus weapons, or a visit to a local firearms store will probably yeild a lot to look at.

If one wanted an economical .308 semi-auto the Sagia's might serve and run around $400ish.

For a very accurate, excellent trigger bolt action the Savage 110 with acu-triggers are some of the best bang for the buck IMHO.

Remember if you want to put glass (rifle scope) on a rifle, that really good ones can cost as much as the rifle, and one definitely wants a dependable scope, and IMHO the rifle should also have back up iron sights in case the scope does go fugazi.

So a reasonable battery of four do it all survivalist type firearms would be

1.  A handgun in a effective caliber, type of your choice
2.  A 22LR for all the utility and cost effectiveness it offers
3.  A centerfire rifle capable of taking the largest game one might encounter, action determined by anticipated needs.  (remember we don't have military logistics, so fighting a war with resupply isn't really a simple thing if TEOTWAWKI is of concern.  More Shoot, scoot, run and hide is what a survivalist would do IMHO / YMMV)
4.  A shotgun (probably a 12 gauge pump) for all that shotty goodness it offers.

Remember that in addition to each weapon you need the accouterments to run that weapon system.  Things like holsters, slings, scopes, cleaning supplies, cases, and Ammo.

Also a means of carrying ammo in quantities to meet anticipated needs.

Reloading is a option that also might be of value, and is a whole other area.

Anyway I have rambled on enough, so I'll end for now.

Thad.

----------


## RockyRaccoon

^^^^^^^^^
I'd say that pretty much covers it lol.

What do you all think about a lever action .22? Or is that too old school for a survival rifle?

----------


## Wildthang

I have always thought, that if I could only have one gun, it would be a bolt action .22. I actually enjoy knowing that I normally have 1 shot to make the kill. And with enough practice, that is normally all it takes.
A bolt action .22, that will shoot .22 shorts, longs, and long rifles, would be especially nice for living in the city. The shorts will kill just about any yard critter, and the report is very low. 
I have a little Marlin XT-22 with a Nikon scope, and it is very versital, and plenty accurate. It is tube feed and it holds more ammo than a 10/22, it is more accurate than a stock 10/22, it only cost $200, and it shoots 3 different cartriges.
I have killed more food critters with a .22 than any other caliber, and never had a problem being able to hit them with 1 shot. I had my 11 year old grandson out shooting yesterday, and he was shooting my XT-22. He was only shooting a paper target, but if he had of been after squirrels or rabbits, those critters would have been in real trouble.
I think the bolt action .22 should be everybody's first gun, and depending on who they are, and what they hunt, it may be the only gun they would ever really need.
I wouldn't hunt deer or any large game with a .22, but in a survival situation, I know without a doubt that a .22 will take deer, just ask any poucher! I knew a poucher in Oklahoma that killed deer almost daily with a .22 rifle. He used a Marlin model 60 tube feed, and rarely if ever lost a deer.
I love many types and calibers, and own more guns that I probably need, but I enjoy shooting my .22's more than most of my other guns.
I agree with several others, that 10/22's are good rifles if you like to modify and start changing a bunch of stuff as soon as you get the rifle, but a good bolt action is pretty much perfect right out of the box. All you need is a good scope!

----------


## kyratshooter

That depends on your definition of "perfect" WT.  A Kimber, CZ or an old Anschutz sporter may be pretty near "perfect" but most low priced .22 rifles need lots of TLC in order to come close to "acceptable" in trigger, fit and accuracy. 

I always wind up putting so much time and workinto the cheap guns trying to bring them up to snuff that I would have been better off just buying a top line rifle to start with. 

Their saving grace it that they are better than nothing, parts are plentiful and many have a good reliability reputation.

----------


## Wildthang

> That depends on your definition of "perfect" WT.  A Kimber, CZ or an old Anschutz sporter may be pretty near "perfect" but most low priced .22 rifles need lots of TLC in order to come close to "acceptable" in trigger, fit and accuracy. 
> 
> I always wind up putting so much time and workinto the cheap guns trying to bring them up to snuff that I would have been better off just buying a top line rifle to start with. 
> 
> 
> Their saving grace it that they are better than nothing, parts are plentiful and many have a good reliability reputation.


Well I must have got lucky, because my little XT-22 shot good right out of the box, and all I had to do is scope it. Ths iron sights were junk, but I wasn't going to use them anyway.
It has the Pro Fire trigger and has a nice light pull, feels like an accutrigger! The fit and finish is plenty good enough for what I am going to do with the rifle.
It's not a CZ or an Anchutz, but for $200 bucks, it is a nice little gun!

----------


## Thaddius Bickerton

> ^^^^^^^^^
> I'd say that pretty much covers it lol.
> 
> What do you all think about a lever action .22? Or is that too old school for a survival rifle?



I love marlin 39a and have shot a few henry 22Lr's.  Nice both of em.

I think lever action rifles in general are wonderful weapons. I have a lot of marlins in lots of calibers
22LR, 357 mag/38special , 41 mag, 44 mag  (still want one in 45 LC)  45 /70, 30/30, 

I also have a winchester 1886 in 45 /70 that I really like and an 1895 in 30 06 that I like.

Id like to get a model 71 or 88 winchester but so far no joy on those

The Savages are wonderful as are the brownings if you want powerful cartridges in the 308 range and to use spire point boolets.

I'd say a lever action is fine for both 22 an centerfire calibers.

A solid 336 marlin in 30 30 can do about any thing I want to do, paired with a 39a in 22LR for small game and a good handgun and it is a good set up.  Or get a 44 mag in revolver and lever and one cartridge fits both your hand and long gun.  Same for 22 hand and long gun.

----------


## Wildthang

I like lever action rifles a lot! I want a .357 lever action carbine to go along with my Colt .357 pistol. Lever action rifles are also known as the cowboy assult rifle, and is second only to the semi auto and full auto rifles when it comes to spittin lead!

----------


## hunter63

So now how many picked a .22?

----------


## Rick

Lemme see now. 2 guzzinta..then you got your prime number...plus the square root being an irrational number. Yep. lever actions would be THIRD right behind semi autos and and full autos. It goes 1, then 2, then 3 and so on.

----------


## shiftyer1

Wildthang.......I have that combo but my revolvers are rugers.  Once you get a 357 lever you'll most likely fall in love.

As far as a 1st rifle purchase,  i'd go with the .22.  Aside from bb guns that was my first.  30 years later it is still my most shot caliber.  Works for most critters,  works best with smaller ones.  And most of the time when you feel the need to burn some ammo,  a few hundred .22 rounds followed by 20-50 rounds of bigger rifle satisfies my needs plinking.

----------


## Wildthang

> Wildthang.......I have that combo but my revolvers are rugers.  Once you get a 357 lever you'll most likely fall in love.
> 
> As far as a 1st rifle purchase,  i'd go with the .22.  Aside from bb guns that was my first.  30 years later it is still my most shot caliber.  Works for most critters,  works best with smaller ones.  And most of the time when you feel the need to burn some ammo,  a few hundred .22 rounds followed by 20-50 rounds of bigger rifle satisfies my needs plinking.


When I take my varmint gun to the range, I plink with a .22 in between barrel cool downs. I actually enjoy shooting the .22 as much as the varmint gun. For some reason I would like to have a short carbine lever gun with the big hoop, dont ask me why, but that rifle just looks cool. I dont know how practical the large loop lever is, but I like the way it looks!

----------


## kyratshooter

> *If you had to pick one of these? Ruger1022,Savage Stevens .308, or Maverick88 12ga??*
> Need some help deciding on my first rifle purchase.  I think of shtf scenerios, home defense, and hunting. Currently working with about $400 and have done lots of reasearch on what I want and these are the three options I am looking at.
> 
> .308 option: Savage-Stevens 200 .308  around $320
> .22lr option: Ruger 10/22 Talo tactical rifle around $300
> 12 ga option: Maverick 88 8shot  around $200
> 
> I want something that will be affordable, reliable and useful in any situation.  Even though I really want the stevens .308 for big game right now I am leaning towards the ruger 10/22 since its lighter and would be able to take down most game I would encounter in the urban environment I currently reside.  Plus the .22 is semiauto and has a high capacity mag where the .308 at MY current price range is bolt action and 4 round mag.  
> 
> ...


Perhaps we did not choose properly or swiftly enough?  Earth Rocks has not posted for over a year now.  It seems he disapeared soon after this decision and I fear he might have actually listened to one of these ill conceived thought processes!

Thing is, I own each of the items he listed and can attest that none of them are top choice even in their geniere!

----------


## Rick

He was last on in February this year so he hasn't shot himself....yet.

----------


## hunter63

I would appear that even a straight forward, specific, question refering to 3 named and specfic firearms...."What is your choice, A.B,or C?"

...is like throwing out the opinion bomb...LOL, I should go back and see how many different calibers, makes, models, and configurations were actually refered to in this thread....with out really giving a straight answer....

Naw, to heck with it.....was kinda fun to see what y'all came up with.....
Carry on

----------


## Wildthang

If I was buying my first rifle, it would be a .22 rifle! Not necessarily a 10/22 though!

----------


## kyratshooter

Well Hunter, you got your information posters and you got your opinion givers.

Information posters are required to actually own a gun and to have possibly shot it more than once so they can at least say "it kicks" or "it's accurate" or "I would buy another one".

Your information givers can do so after visiting a pawn shop and their posts usually go "It feels good in your hands" or "I like the way it looks" preceeded by other statements that begin with "It should...."

As it turns out I happen to have all three on the list and I can honestly say that I would have to look at the situation before I grabbed one of the three.  I am not hunting squirrels with the .308 under normal circumstance and I am not chasing bad guys with the 10/22 and 200 yard shots with the Maverick 88 are out of consideration.

From there it simply falls under the consideration of what will be you most needed firearm.

One thing I can say is that Earth Rocks is paying WAAAAAAY too much for his guns!

----------


## EarthRocks

Well thanks guys for giving advice even when I was not around.  I appreciate all the information that was useful and not useful.   Alot of the information made me second guess my second guesses and I appreciate this site and its members.  I wish I knew where all the good gun prices where hiding, Ive been searching locally and findings everything overpriced.  I still plan to keep shopping and looking into the coming up gun shows for my next purchases. 

My decision has been made, and I have placed my order with Buds for my Ruger 10/22 Model 1287 for $350 including my FFL transfer fee.  This was one of my orginal choices and I watched this gun's price slowly go up, and then go out of stock multiple times. (Gun went to VIP member only a day after I ordered, and was sold out three days later) I searched locally for a basic 10/22 NEW, and found them for $200, and then researched all the parts the MODEL 1287 comes with for their individual prices and found it was much cheaper to purchase the gun as this kit then build it myself.   I wasnt sure if it was overpriced, but once talking to others who purchased 10/22's from my hometown I realized my deal wasnt so bad after all.  I paid $329 while my buddy paid $300 for the standard 10/22.  Realizing this, I placed the order last friday, and expecting it thursday. 

I felt it was alot to spend on a .22, but it came with parts that I would of ordered anyways.
I went ahead an ordered another bx-25 round ruger mag.

Now that I have my 22 to make my day at the range affordable, I can start practicing, practicing, practicing.
I have already saved another $300 and plan to attend local gunshows and make my local gunshop area larger and go a little further.
I will be looking to get a 12 gauge next for large game protection while out camping.
And then work my way to a centerfire rifle while shooting cheap 22 ammo as often as possible.

I again want to thank everyone who has posted information so far.  It all has been invaluable for a rifle rookie like myself.  I will post a pic as soon as it is home.

----------


## EarthRocks

> ^^^^^^^^^
> I'd say that pretty much covers it lol.
> 
> What do you all think about a lever action .22? Or is that too old school for a survival rifle?


Actually Im a huge fan of the lever action rifles. They look like a ton of fun to shoot, but would want a .357 or 30-30 lever action rather then the .22

----------


## EarthRocks

> I would appear that even a straight forward, specific, question refering to 3 named and specfic firearms...."What is your choice, A.B,or C?"
> 
> ...is like throwing out the opinion bomb...LOL, I should go back and see how many different calibers, makes, models, and configurations were actually refered to in this thread....with out really giving a straight answer....
> 
> Naw, to heck with it.....was kinda fun to see what y'all came up with.....
> Carry on


hahaha that is kinda what I realized after posting.  But I couldnt of been more pleased, and impressed with all the useful information.  I know alot of it gets repetative after doing reasearch for months and months, and appreciate all the seasoned advice I received.

It was very fun seeing what people came up with.  

And glad to see people still have a sense of humor.  Thanks again everyone!

----------


## hunter63

Thanks for the up date, seems we never get an answer or choice......and after all the chuckin' and jivin'....The OP just kinda wonders off with all these choices in his head, and says, "Screw it,..... I gonna get me a Dillion Mini gun and solve all my problems, boys"

----------


## EarthRocks

Yall are welcome.  No way I would leave my fellow survivalist and gun enthusiast hanging after all that information flung my way.

----------

