# General > General Knives & Blades >  Do you use a chemical or an oil as a rust inhibitor on your blades?

## jc1234

I have a wonderful knife that I take on every hike and camping trip.  I would live and die by this knife, it is part of me, as far as knives go, it is my soul mate.  Its made of cpm-s30v, and debating of steel properties in general aside, it has ok rust resistance, but I spend A LOT of time in water and snow and the knife gets wet, sappy, and otherwise icky pretty regularly.  The knife spends its time in a kydex sheath while hiking / camping and I do try to wipe it down regularly when out, but sometimes it has to wait until i get home to get a real good wipe down and cleaning

The bladesmith recommended that I use pb blaster which I have been using for about 9 months and its worked phenomenally well, but there have been a few times when I really would have liked to have used the knife to cut food  (like cuting apart raw ribs, or a cooked steak)  or cut into a package of something when Ive realized that I forgot my eating utensils or when my multitool just wouldnt cut it (no pun intended), but the fact that Id used a chemical rust inhibitor made that dangerous due to the risk of ingestion.  

This got me thinking whether pb blaster, or any chemical rust inhibitor is that much better than mineral oil.  If minieral oil would work just as well, its safer and definitely cheaper.  However pb blaster seems to work so well, Im afraid to switch.  This knife is too expensive to ever buy again and takes to long to make and with the sheer amount of steel and number of thermo quenching cycles, its pretty much indestructible, except for rust.

What is your opinion?

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## LowKey

I just use a light machine oil. 3-in-1 or a sewing machine type oil.
Not just on knives but also when cleaning up the garden tools for winter storage.
Machine oil on the metal, Linseed oil on the wooden handles.

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## jc1234

> I just use a light machine oil. 3-in-1 or a sewing machine type oil.
> Not just on knives but also when cleaning up the garden tools for winter storage.
> Machine oil on the metal, Linseed oil on the wooden handles.


Wouldnt 3 in 1 oil be bad to ingest too though?  I have G10 and Micarta handles, so thats not an issue.

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## LowKey

I don't know. 
When I think about all the fish the knife has scaled, gutted and cleaned, after cutting bait all day, I think the oil is the least of my problems.
Some of the real knife guys will be along, I'm sure.

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## jc1234

> I don't know. 
> When I think about all the fish the knife has scaled, gutted and cleaned, after cutting bait all day, I think the oil is the least of my problems.
> Some of the real knife guys will be along, I'm sure.


And it may not be an issue.  Its just that all these products state something like "molecularly bonds to metal and continues to protect even after wet or wiped off" or something similar.  So, it makes me worry about using it on food.  I may be really over thinking this, but nothing sucks like being sick while out camping.

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## crashdive123

I use mineral oil, olive oil or petroleum jelly - all food grade.

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## Rick

Ditto on the mineral oil and petroleum jelly. They say olive oil can go rancid but I've never seen that happen. Even if it does it won't kill you. Going rancid is a form of oxidation.

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## roar-k

> I use mineral oil, olive oil or petroleum jelly - all food grade.


+1, this is what I do.  Not to mention I always carry 2-4oz of olive oil when I go backpacking and then I usually have more when camping.

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## jc1234

So no rust or pitting issues with the oil?

How do you clean out the sheaths after it has built up, just some warm water?

How does the oil hold up after the knife is submerged for a while, is it totally gone or does it still manage to protect a bit?

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## crashdive123

The food grade oils do not hold up as long as some of the other products.  If I'm backpacking I will usually have a small bottle/tube of oil for cooking.  I always have pj cotton balls in my fire kit.  I'll usually check all of my gear at the end of the day and do any maintenance while sitting around the fire.

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## jc1234

> The food grade oils do not hold up as long as some of the other products.  If I'm backpacking I will usually have a small bottle/tube of oil for cooking.  I always have pj cotton balls in my fire kit.  I'll usually check all of my gear at the end of the day and do any maintenance while sitting around the fire.


Thats the other benefit of an oil.  I dont like carrying pb blaster in my pack because it is such a harsh chemical, that if it leaked it would destroy some of my gear and make some clothing unwearable.  If mineral oil leaks, it just sort of sucks but thats about it.

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## Pocomoonskyeyes3

> ......The bladesmith recommended that I use pb blaster which I have been using for about 9 months and its worked phenomenally well, but there have been a few times when I really would have liked to have used the knife to cut food  (like cuting apart raw ribs, or a cooked steak)  or cut into a package of something when Ive realized that I forgot my eating utensils or when my multitool just wouldnt cut it (no pun intended), but the fact that Id used a chemical rust inhibitor made that dangerous due to the risk of ingestion.....
> What is your opinion?


Well for Sheer availability and low price I don't think there is anything better than Petroleum Jelly (Vaseline®) [I did the ® using my Character map.... before anyone asks :Smartass: ] or for a more durable coating paraffin will work too. Both are food grade safe.(Paraffin is used in canning.) Both can be found in just about any little rinky-dink town's grocery store. Both are multi-purpose use items ( PJ and cotton balls are Great fire starters, and paraffin is great for waterproofing those strike anywhere matches[If you can find them]) even Bee's wax will work. Some tell me that Food grade mineral oil is easy to find... but I still haven't found any, At least not in my town any ways.

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## crashdive123

Another ting to consider with your carbon steel knives is to force a patina on it.  It is really simple to do and will afford your blade a little added protection - just won't be real shiny.

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## jc1234

> Well for Sheer availability and low price I don't think there is anything better than Petroleum Jelly (Vaseline®) [I did the ® using my Character map.... before anyone asks] or for a more durable coating paraffin will work too. Both are food grade safe.(Paraffin is used in canning.) Both can be found in just about any little rinky-dink town's grocery store. Both are multi-purpose use items ( PJ and cotton balls are Great fire starters, and paraffin is great for waterproofing those strike anywhere matches[If you can find them]) even Bee's wax will work. Some tell me that Food grade mineral oil is easy to find... but I still haven't found any, At least not in my town any ways.


Try the medication section or first aid section.  Its sold in our local drug store as a laxative.




> Another ting to consider with your carbon steel knives is to force a patina on it.  It is really simple to do and will afford your blade a little added protection - just won't be real shiny.


I only use stainless.  I had a 1095 carbon and kept getting tiny pits and rust spots, most of which I could get off with a fine brass brush, but pitting is pitting.  I only carry stainless now, I am just in and around water so much that it made sense.  I could have had my knife made with cpm 3v for increased strength, but opted for the s30v for the added stain resistance and Ive been really happy with it.  Of course, Im stuck wondering if part of the stain resistance has been the pb blaster lol.

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## Camp10

> I could have had my knife made with cpm 3v for increased strength, but opted for the s30v for the added stain resistance and Ive been really happy with it.  Of course, Im stuck wondering if part of the stain resistance has been the pb blaster lol.


You'll be fine with CPM S30V.  That steel is very strong, tough, and rust resistant.  I messed a blade up about a year ago and tossed the steel out behind the garage to see how it would hold up.  I havnt checked it in a few months but at last check, it looked as good as it did when I put it there.  If you are worried, use a little Petroleum jelly.  It wont build up because you only need to wipe a thin coat on your blade.  It will last until you use the knife.  At that point, just take a cotton ball soaked in it that you keep in your fire starting kit (right?) and re-wipe the blade.

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## jc1234

> You'll be fine with CPM S30V.  That steel is very strong, tough, and rust resistant.  I messed a blade up about a year ago and tossed the steel out behind the garage to see how it would hold up.  I havnt checked it in a few months but at last check, it looked as good as it did when I put it there.  If you are worried, use a little Petroleum jelly.  It wont build up because you only need to wipe a thin coat on your blade.  It will last until you use the knife.  At that point, just take a cotton ball soaked in it that you keep in your fire starting kit (right?) and re-wipe the blade.


Good to know about the CPM S30V.  The knife is 1/4" thick at its widest and is not very hallowed, has a wide edge, more of a chopper than a fine cutting instrument and works well.  I figured with that much steel it really didnt matter what it was made of, it would hold up ok.  

The petroleum jelly idea is nice because its really compact and wont spill no matter what happens.  No, I carry fatwood shavings as the smallest morst flammable part of my fire starting kit since they work really well with the magnesium firestarter, but I probably should carry them. I can throw a film canister of petroleum jelly and cotton balls in a pocket easy enough.

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## hunter63

> I only use stainless.  I had a 1095 carbon and kept getting tiny pits and rust spots, most of which I could get off with a fine brass brush, but pitting is pitting.  I only carry stainless now, I am just in and around water so much that it made sense.  I could have had my knife made with cpm 3v for increased strength, but opted for the s30v for the added stain resistance and Ive been really happy with it.  Of course, Im stuck wondering if part of the stain resistance has been the pb blaster lol.


If you only carry stainless, I wouldn't worry about carring anything for your knives.
Not supposed to rust?

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## jc1234

> If you only carry stainless, I wouldn't worry about carring anything for your knives.
> Not supposed to rust?


Not supposed to, but I have seen stainless rust.  Granted this is my first time with cpm s30v.  I am waist deep in water a lot of the time during summer and in winter I am waiste deep or otherwise wet with snow.  Granted I dont actually get wet or cold in the snow, my knife is wet the majority of the time I am out with it, so I try to be extra careful.  The reason being, I will likely never be able to afford to replace my knife.  I use the hell out of it, but I try to take care of it too.

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## rwc1969

Surprisingly enough SS can rust. The only time I've experienced though is on my cheap china made Buck fixed blade. After advice recieved here I started using mineral oil for all my steel and wood items. I got mine in the pharmacy.

Tallow can be used as well and can be procured easily in the field. It is also much more water repellant and durable than plain oil, more like parrafin wax I would think. I wouldn't use tallow that was rendered with salt though.

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## SARKY

I use Fluid Film, it's a lanolin based product (pretty much the oily sweat off of sheep)

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## jc1234

> Surprisingly enough SS can rust. The only time I've experienced though is on my cheap china made Buck fixed blade. After advice recieved here I started using mineral oil for all my steel and wood items. I got mine in the pharmacy.
> 
> Tallow can be used as well and can be procured easily in the field. It is also much more water repellant and durable than plain oil, more like parrafin wax I would think. I wouldn't use tallow that was rendered with salt though.


Same here.  Ive had 440 and 440c steel rust on me too in the field.  As well as a few decent stainless kitchen knives.  How does one come about tallow in the field, what exactly is it?




> I use Fluid Film, it's a lanolin based product (pretty much the oily sweat off of sheep)


I think Id rather ingest pb blaster lol.  Ive never heard of that.  How did you come across it?  I thought I had heard of most of them out there.

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## kyratshooter

> Another ting to consider with your carbon steel knives is to force a patina on it.  It is really simple to do and will afford your blade a little added protection - just won't be real shiny.


My normal use kitchen knives are carbon steel.  One is a green River Ripper and the other is a blade made from a sawmill band saw.  These knives spend hours at a time processing food, doing normal kitchen chores, soaking in the sink.  The blades get a simple wipe-down and go into the knife block.  No rust or pitting problems due to the heavy dark patina.  

The only time I have rust or pitting issues with my knives is when I store them in the leather sheaths for LOOOOONG periods of time.  6 months or so, never the next day or overnight.  

As Crash says, I force the patina, sometimes I even use Plumb Brown for my BP rifles or instant gun blue on new blades to darken them.  Usually, just using them in the kitchen for a couple of days at my place will do the job;  dip them in coca-cola, stir chicken stew, slice some tomatoes.

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## Rick

If your sheath is leather then make certain you don't store your knife in it. Storing it in the sheath will help promote rust. I clean my gear after each trip, too. That includes wiping down my knife and checking it for any problems. Sharpening or touch up depending on what it needs. 0000 steel wool is a good method of removing any small amounts of rust that might form.

As I understand it, all stainless steel has some carbon in it. The percentage of carbon depending on the type of SS. The carbon is what causes it to rust as RWC indicated.

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## hunter63

> .............As I understand it, all stainless steel has some carbon in it. The percentage of carbon depending on the type of SS. The carbon is what causes it to rust as RWC indicated.


Actually the other way around, a steel alloy:

Quote>
In metallurgy stainless steel, also known as inox steel or inox from French "inoxydable", is defined as a steel alloy with a minimum of 10.5[1] or 11% chromium content by mass.[2] Stainless steel does not stain, corrode, or rust as easily as ordinary steel, but it is not stain-proof. <Quote.

From:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stainless_steel

I am a patina fan myself, and I think the stainless that does stain is a poor alloy.
I am a WD40 fan as well, and if any wiping down is done, that what I use. Seems to have less of the "brown stuff" in it than pb Blaster.

Mostly just keeping it clean, and wiped down does the trick for me.

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## rwc1969

I know my true Made in the USA Buck fixed blade doesn't rust and I've never put a drop of oil on it. I was reading the literature that came with it, way back when I got it, and they said it's not true stainless, but it looks and behaves like stainless. I've even left it with blood on it and it never rusted.

jc1234 look here for tallow info

http://www.wilderness-survival.net/f...=making+tallow

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## jc1234

> I know my true Made in the USA Buck fixed blade doesn't rust and I've never put a drop of oil on it. I was reading the literature that came with it, way back when I got it, and they said it's not true stainless, but it looks and behaves like stainless. I've even left it with blood on it and it never rusted.
> 
> jc1234 look here for tallow info
> 
> http://www.wilderness-survival.net/f...=making+tallow


Thats a really neat instruction manual for making tallow, doesnt it go rancid eventually?  petroleum is so much easier and I can buy it in large quantities for cheap that I will probably go that way in all honesty.  But its neat to know how to do this.

Ive had 440 steel and 1095 carbon steel develop rust.  Now, the 440 was a cheapy from china, so who knows.  The 1095 was good steel, but it only developed surface rust and with some moderate work I could get it off.  The thing is that was a $250.00 knife and I didnt think it should be so much work to maintain (granted it would spend hours being wet repeatedly for days at a time) even with regular wipe downs with mineral oil.  When I made the step up to custom knives and  had the option of 1095, cpm s30v or cpm 3v, I wanted the most stain resistance available of those options.  The only other difference is that my 1095 knife was kept in a nylon sheath and this one is kept in a kydex.  I dont know how much of a difference that makes.

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## rwc1969

It should "never" go rancid now, but never's a big word and time will tell. I agree petroleum is the more practical way to go, just threw it out there for gits and shiggles.

But, I plan on trying it on my air rifle as it tends to rust where you grip the barrel to cock it and I think the tallow may be more durable and lasting than the oils I use which are typically rem-oil or 3 in 1 type oils.

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## crashdive123

Keep in mind that with 440 stainless steel, that there are several different grades available (A, B, C, D).  440 is kind of a catchall name, and not necessarily indicative of the quality.

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## Wood Duck

Most of my knives are Carbon and very few are stainless steel. With the carbon blades I usually force a patina on them. Its really easy and for me it helps the blade last. You can use anything from mustard, vinegar, lemons, oranges, or even potatoes to force the patina. I like using oranges then soaking a string in vinegar. After leaving the blade in a orange for about 2 hours you pull it out and then I wrap the vinegar soaked string around it. The longer you leave the string on the darker the patina. I enjoy trying different designs with the string. Again this just my opinion.

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## SARKY

think Id rather ingest pb blaster lol. Ive never heard of that. How did you come across it? I thought I had heard of most of them out there.

Ran across it at a gun show in Maine. It is really great stuff. Won't hurt wood or plastic. Stays where you put it and doesn't take all kinds of solvents to wipe off.

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## Wood Duck

I ran across it a while back while doing Toy's For Tots while I was in service. The guy playing Santa Clause was a knife expert. On our down time he showed me how to properly sharpen a blade. On our down time he would share information and I listened. It's really amazing what the older generation has to say if we only stopped and listened. That was in 2004 and I believe he was 70ish then.

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## Camp10

You can buy PB at Home Depot.  I have also picked it up at Pep Boys in the past.  It is pretty good stuff but I've never used it on a knife...it smells bad.   I havnt picked up a can of WD-40 sense I discovered PB.

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## jc1234

> You can buy PB at Home Depot.  I have also picked it up at Pep Boys in the past.  It is pretty good stuff but I've never used it on a knife...it smells bad.   I havnt picked up a can of WD-40 sense I discovered PB.


I wouldnt have thought to use it on a knife either, but when I asked the bladesmith what he recommended, that was what he said he recommends to use on all his knives.  The smell is pretty bad and I do worry about the long term effects on the G10 and micarta handles as well as kydex.

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## rockedge

I use to protect my knife with mineral oil since I use it for hunting, and the humid conditions where I live, but I find out that paraffin oil know as petroleum jelly or white petrolatum (Vaseline) is, denser, odorless, not aggressive to food, and cheaper. 

Good luck out there

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## BScout

> I use Fluid Film, it's a lanolin based product (pretty much the oily sweat off of sheep)





> I think Id rather ingest pb blaster lol.  Ive never heard of that.  How did you come across it?  I thought I had heard of most of them out there.


First there was WD-40

Then there was PB Blaster

And now there's Fluid Film.

I've used all of the above and found Fluid Film blows away the others.  I have all 3 in the shop and haven't touched the WD-40 or PB in a couple years (and only when I couldn't find the FF).  Oh, and for breaking loose frozen parts, Kroil is the way to go.

http://www.fluid-film.com/

It has thousands of application uses and I've used it on hundreds myself.  Everything from metal protection to electrical connections and everything in between.  Give it a try.  I'll bet you'll be happy with it.

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## edr730

I've oiled or waxed tools almost every day for many years.  I have a few tools that need to be very clean and lubricated. I don't worry about what oil I use outside. Pocomoon is correct about the durability of paraffin or bees wax because there is no comparison between the durability between those two items and oils. That is, if durability is an issue. Paraffin doesn't apply that easily and takes a little hot sunshine or heat to apply best. Beeswax is easier. My complaint about any petroleum based oil, that I have tried so far, is that they soon turn black. I'll try the olive oil that Rick mentioned. My vote would be the beeswax or olive oil on the knife.

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## Rick

Not olive oil. I use food grade mineral oil. Olive oil can go rancid. Someone along the way mentioned petroleum jelly and it seems reasonable to me to use it. It won't harm you if you eat it so getting it on food is not a concern. I don't know if it will turn blades black. It is a petroleum based chemical.

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## edr730

Sorry, it was Crash who mentioned the olive oil. Petroleum jelly will never turn the knife itself black. You can't tell by looking at it. If you wipe it with a white rag after a while you will see it on the rag. At least it will always happen with the tools I use and it will not happen if I use soap or canning wax. Oils turning black may only be an issue for me and I'm really not sure if it's only a reaction with the metal.

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## shiftyer1

I always carry a carbon steel pocket knife,  they see regular use.  All have a patina and really don't rust,  once in a blue moon i'll wipe some oil on them with a paper towel.  I use....whatever is handy when I see it needs to be done.  And it gets used for food also.  I think cutting a steak helps protect against rust also :Smile: 

I've also seen lots of stainless rust,  I think it's mostly the cheap knives (gas station quality) that rust.

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## Rick

Oh, not so little weedhopper. My Old Cutlery knives need pretty religious care to avoid rust. Carbon steel rusts no matter the cost or who makes them. The only question is how much and how fast and that's where the owner comes in. It's us against rust!

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## shiftyer1

I know carbon rusts easily,  my comment was directed toward cheap stainless.  Maybe i've just been lucky?

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## Highhawk1948

Never thought about it.  Use my knives all the time.  Wash them off with water or just wipe them off, then spray or wipe some Rem oil or 3 in 1 oil. Put them back in the sheath. I use a leaher sheath for all of my "trappper" pocket knives, hard to get to them in your pocket if you are driving or riding.  Use them to eat with and never worried about it.  My wife hates it when I pull a Moore Maker or Case Trapper out in the Resturant.  But I like to use sharpe knives that will cut.  Thank God I'm a County Boy!!!

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## Rick

Why don't you convert to vaseline and save the wear and tear on your gizzard? Of course with the 3in1 you won't squeak when you walk.

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## Highhawk1948

That is a good idea, probably will help my arthritis too.  I have used vasoline on knives if they will be put up for a while and it worked fine.

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