# Survival > Survival Kits & Survival Products >  First Aid kit question, What's in the next level, & next.

## Sourdough

Please pay attention, NOT talking about "Survival" kit. Only First Aid Kits. I think or hope we all know what is in the basic first aid kit. If kit "Level #6" is a fully stocked ambulance, and kit Level #10 is the mother of all hospitals.

What is in Kit "Level" #2, #3, #4 (what is in the advanced kit #2) What is in the super advanced kit #3, and so on.

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## Rick

SD - I don't have different levels of first aid kits. I have one kit that I carry regardless of where I'm going or what I plan to do. If you believe band-aids are important then they are important no matter where you are (that's an example). That being said, here is what I carry with me. 

 First Aid Kit – Condor Rip Away Pouch 

  Total weight including pouch is 2lb 9oz. 
1 oz triple antibiotic ointment
2 bandage guage roller 2" x 6 yards
1 EMT shears
1 needle forceps
2 tweezers
1 nail clippers
2 closure strip 1/4" X 1 1/2"
4 6-0 Polyester Fiber Suture with 3/8" scalpel point needle (1 per pack)
2 Povidone-Iodine Prep pads
18 Alcohol Prep Pads (fire starter, too)
1 instant cold compress
2 Little Hotties hand warmers
1 4" x 4" sterile pad
1 5" X 9" ABD Pad Extra Absorbent
1 3" X 8" gauze bandage
  3 Butterfly closure
11 regular bandaids
  1 one inch self-adhesive bandage
  4 sets of gloves
30 Hydrocodone 500 Mg tabs
12 Cipro 500 Mg tabs
  30 Amoxicillin 500 Mg tabs
1 50 g QuikClot Sport
2 6" wooden splints
Assorted sizes of Moleskin Plus
1 Dressing, First-Aid, Field, 11 3/4 inches square
11 plastic snip bandaids
2 Insect Sting relief towlettes
12 antihistimines
2 twelve inch roles of one inch Velcro strapping (splints)
  1 25-foot piece of paracord
1 box Luden's cough drops
1 Fresnel lens
  1 BIC lighter
4 1 use size Triple Antibiotic ointment
2 antacid tablets
2 acetaminophen tablets
6 Loperamide Hydrochloride (anti diarrhea) 
1 1" roll guaze 
10 Q tips
1 tube chap-ez
1 splinter remover
1 single use tube of neosporin
2 single use tube of First Aid Burn Cream 
1 Burnaid Burn Gel
1 NexTemp disposable thermometer 
1 First Aid Pamplet
  1 36” SAM Splint (the Sam Splint is folded into thirds and strapped to the bottom of the kit)
1 bottle Refresh Tears
12 Orajel medicated tooth swabs

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## finallyME

You put all that in a condor?  I just wish Safe Zone sold a condor that was coyote brown or desert camo or multicam.

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## Rick

It has also been pointed out by others that knowledge is the most important component in a first aid kit. You can carry an I.V. in your first aid gear but if you don't know how to use it then it's of no value. Only carry what you are proficient in using and keep your training up to date.

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## Rick

Being married to an RN has it's advantages. She's my medical advisor and I follow her judgement closely (as well as all orders she dictates).

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## LowKey

Lucky for you to be able to talk a doc into writing you scripts. I can see someone like SD getting those but sure can't get them here. Doctors here are paranoid.

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## crashdive123

Not sure about levels, but my most basic is (now that I make knives) carrying 3 band aids in my wallet.

The first aid kit that accompanies me on my day hikes is as follows:

5  3X2 Non-stick pads
4  4X2 band aids
20  3X1 band aids
30  1-1/2X1/4 ban aids
1  ace bandage
1  small roll of gauze
2  3X3 gauze pads
2  3X2 gauze pads
1  knuckle bandage
4  tape closure strips
1  25g Quick Clot
1  small Sam Splint
1  roll med tape
1  forceps
1  tweezers
1  wooden tongue depressor
1  Neosporin
20  alcohol prep pads
2  sting relief pads2  benzalkonium chloride towelettes  (helps prevent skin infections)
3  packs of Medi-Lyte tablets (electrolyte replacement)
3  Neomycin Antibiotic cream
2  iodine prep pads
20 - Ibuprofen
3  packeks Medi-Phenyl (decongestant)
3  packs (6 tabs) Tylenol
1  moleskin
4  eye lubricating drops
24  tabs Loperamide Hydrochloride (anti-diarrhea)
10 - Benadryl
6 - finger cots 
2  pair Nitril gloves
1  First aid guide
2  pleated face masks

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I have a much larger first aid kit that stays in my "camping truck" and small ones that sit in work vehicles.

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## COWBOYSURVIVAL

This post was very timely for me. I ordered the 3 shoulder bags for each of my family. I plan to pack the basics for our outings so each of us has our own. Reality is someone dies in my swamp every year.

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## Rick

@ Lowkey - That's one more reason why it's important to have a good working relationship with the right doctor. In my case, my PCP has hiked several different continents as well as military time and fully understands what can happen under the right circumstances. He also knows me and trusts that I'll use them for what they are intended. When I go in and ask for a refill I take the original container with me so he can see first hand that what he wrote is still in the bottle. Trust is a two way street. You have to trust your doctor but they have to trust you, too. If not, then you need to find another doctor.

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## Rick

CS - Try to research what the majority died from and that's what you need to focus on. At least it's a starting point.

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## Highhawk1948

Cody Lundin,(TV show Dual Survivor), has a couple of good books on Urban and Wilderness Survival.  Good lists of first aid and survival kits and pretty much does what Rick suggests.  Find out what kills people in different enviornments and works from there.

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## LowKey

Rick, that's very true with docs.
But due to the circumstances of mandated care in MA, I've had very little chance to build a relationship with a doc. I've changed PCPs 3 times in just the last 7 years due to shifts in health care availability. It really Sucks.

I'm happy to say though, that with a few exceptions, my kit is pretty much like yours. One in the house and one in the truck. A much smaller one in my hiking/fishing kit, a small one in the range bag, and one in the desk drawer at work that goes in the tool box when we get driven in a company vehicle to a jobsite.

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## Rick

I was asked to post some pics on my first aid kit and how I jammed all that stuff in there. In reality, I probably have more than that right now because I added a bunch of bandaids for softball tournaments my grand daughter was in. It sort of became the defacto first aid kit for the team. Anyway, here it is. 

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The kit is a Condor Rip-Away EMT Pouch and I've stuck a velcro red cross on it. On the bottom of the kit you can see a SAM Splint folded up. There was no more room inside so the exterior strap holds it on. 

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This is the kit laid open. You can see there are three sections. One zippered section on the left and two other sections that have pockets and loops. 

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The right hand section contains: (top to bottom, left to right)

4 pairs of gloves
EMT shears
suture tweezers
2 standard tweezers
nail clippers
needle forceps
2 one-inch gauze
1 triple anti-biotic ointment
Abdominal pad
4 sutures (6-0 with 3/8 scalpal point)
1 cold compress 
1 4x4 pad
two little hotties hand warmers
2 alcohol prep pads
2 iodine pads
2 closure strips

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The middle section contains (top to bottom, left to right)

25 feet paracord
30 Hydrocodone 500 Mg tabs
12 Cipro 500 Mg. tabs
2 wooden splints/tongue depressors
1 Field Dressing
Assorted mole skin
1 role colflex tape (sticks to itself)
1 50g QuikClot

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Left hand zippered section contains. (top to bottom, left to right)

1 box Ludens cough drops
1 BIC lighter
1 Tums
1 Chapstick
1 30 Amoxicillin Tabs
Tylenol
10 Q-tips
Steri-Strips
1 Neosporin
4 inch bandages
1 inche bandages
1 Fresnel magnifying lens
2 insect sting relief wipes
12 antihistimines
2 velcro straps (splints)
Another steri-strip
1 roll gauze
triple antibiotic 
1/2 inch bandaids
pencil with duct tape
Loperamide Hydrochloride (anti-diarrhea)
2 antacid tablets (upper)
NexTemp Thermometer (lower)
Burnaid Burn Gel
Splinter remover (upper)
Iodine pads (lower)
1/4 inch band aids
1 bottle Refresh Tears (added after this posting)
12 Orajel tooth swabs (added after this posting)
First Aid Pamplet

I think that's everything. If anything is unclear just ask.

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## Sourdough

So Rick, Not counting the dope. If you made up those kits for sale and assuming a profit for the time and effort, what do you think you would have to charge for a kit like that.....???

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## Rick

Off the top of my head about $150....give or take. A stupid bottle of Tylenol is about $12.

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## BENESSE

Thanks Rick, I always enjoy seeing what others carry and adjusting my own kit accordingly. One thing I carry and have found useful is sterile eye wash/artificial tears. I'd get trash/dust/bugs my eyes and it helps to have something to wash it out.

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## Rick

That's definitely good stuff. Just watch the expiration date on it. Refresh Tears is good but doesn't last long on the date.

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## BENESSE

No way around this, but I sure hate the waste of expired meds; or maybe I should just be grateful for not having needed them (so far) very frequently.
But it always hurts throwing away bottles of Advil, Tylenol, Zyrtec, antibiotics, cold & flu meds, eye drops, brittle Band Aids and dried out towelettes of one sort or another.

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## Sarge47

I actually ordered one of the Condor EMT pouches from Rick and it arrived today!  I called him and asked him if he could post some pics revealing the contents and how they are packed.  Great job Rick!  While I'm sure I won't be carrying every little thing you do, you've given me some great ideas!   :clap:   :Thumbup1:   :Cool2:

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## Rick

B - I've always told my wife that my great wish is I've wasted my money on preps. If I never have to use them for anything I will have lived a very blessed life. I try not to look at as sunk costs but rather disasters that didn't happen. 

Sarge - That's what it's all about. Sharing ideas and creating sparks for new ones.

Crash has some good ideas up above as well.

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## Sarge47

> Crash has some good ideas up above as well.


Agreed!  This is what I've been waiting for!   :Cool2:

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## crashdive123

I like the Condor EMT pouch.  Looks like much easier access.  I need to reduce the numbers of a few of my items (since this is for my day hikes) and add a few things.

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## Rick

B - I have to agree with you on the eye wash. I picked up some Refresh Tears yesterday along with some Orajel for a toothache (yeah, yeah, I know about clove oil) and added both to the first aid kit. Thanks for jogging my noodle on that. I had always figured I could use water as an eye flush but sometimes you don't have any and it's not always about flushing the eye. Sometimes tired eyes can be comforted with Refresh Tears where water won't do the job.

I updated both lists above.

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## crashdive123

I wear contact lenses and use reading glasses (carry my bi-focals).  An important part of my fak is the refresh (bottom left of the picture I posted).  I use it quite often (not while wearing contacts).  Crawling in attics, under homes, grinding steel, grinding micarta and bone - while I wear safety glasses, I often give my  eyes a lube job with the Refresh.

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## Mad Cow

I can only offer this, I deeply cut my arm, and depleted my kit in a 10 minutes. Just stopping the blood went threw all my big bandages, and I lacked a way to clean the would. A means of closing it would have been nice to. I tried crazy glue, but it did not work. Hope that was helpful.

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## Rick

MC - Even if the wound was deep stopping the blood should only have required a compression bandage and NOT REMOVING IT. If it soaked through then add another on top of it. Removing any bandage will removing any clots that have formed beneath the bandage and allow the wound to continue bleeding. What did you finally do to address the wound (I assume it's not still bleeding) and do you have any type of issue such as hemophilia that would prevent normal clotting?

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## Mad Cow

I do take beta blockers, but nothing else. The bleeding was not continuous, just one giant squirt and it was over. I was trying to keep the blood flowing as the knife had just been in a pig. What I was getting at, is that if I had cut my self to the point ware I got an artery, my kit was not adequate enough to deal with that. It also took a third of my kit to deal with the injury. When I replenish it I plan on adding some bandages for huge wounds, better antiseptic, and some of that clotting stuff.

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## Rick

Oh. Got it.

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## Highhawk1948

I have carried Kotex or other like products for years to use as compresses.  Those are good kits in the pictures and lists.  I enjoy being ready.



Ride, Shoot Straight, and Speak the Truth; T.Roosevelt

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## Mad Cow

> I have carried Kotex or other like products for years to use as compresses.  Those are good kits in the pictures and lists.  I enjoy being ready.
> 
> 
> 
> Ride, Shoot Straight, and Speak the Truth; T.Roosevelt


Diapers to.

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## Rick

I know this is an older thread but rather than start a new one I thought I'd just add to this one. Same subject. 

As my grand kids have gotten older and involved more and more into sports I was concerned that my EDC First aid kit just wasn't enough for some of the weird injuries sports can give you. Gym floors are wood and hard. All you have to do is bounce a young noggin' off the floor to have a very serious, potentially life threatening, injury. My grand kids are into softball, baseball, volleyball and basketball at this stage so that's a lot of different environments to contend with. With that in mind, I built a full trauma kit around my first aid kid. Hopefully, it's enough to keep a kid breathing until EMTs can take over, which is my only goal. Gotta keep them going during that 1st golden hour. Just some things for you to think about and critique if you choose. 

I've posted above but just to keep it straight here's my EDC first aid kit. 

First Aid Kit – Condor Rip Away Pouch

Total weight including pouch is 2lb 9oz.
1 oz triple antibiotic ointment
2 bandage guage roller 2" x 6 yards
1 EMT shears
1 needle forceps
2 tweezers
1 nail clippers
2 closure strip 1/4" X 1 1/2"
4 6-0 Polyester Fiber Suture with 3/8" scalpel point needle (1 per pack)
2 Povidone-Iodine Prep pads
18 Alcohol Prep Pads (fire starter, too)
1 instant cold compress
2 Little Hotties hand warmers
1 4" x 4" sterile pad
1 5" X 9" ABD Pad Extra Absorbent
1 3" X 8" gauze bandage
3 Butterfly closure
11 regular bandaids
1 one inch self-adhesive bandage
4 sets of gloves
30 Hydrocodone 500 Mg tabs
12 Cipro 500 Mg tabs
30 Amoxicillin 500 Mg tabs
1 50 g QuikClot Sport
2 6" wooden splints
Assorted sizes of Moleskin Plus
1 Dressing, First-Aid, Field, 11 3/4 inches square
11 plastic snip bandaids
2 Insect Sting relief towlettes
12 antihistimines
2 twelve inch roles of one inch Velcro strapping (splints)
1 25-foot piece of paracord
1 box Luden's cough drops
1 Fresnel lens
1 BIC lighter
4 1 use size Triple Antibiotic ointment
2 antacid tablets
2 acetaminophen tablets
6 Loperamide Hydrochloride (anti diarrhea)
1 1" roll guaze
10 Q tips
1 tube chap-ez
1 splinter remover
1 single use tube of neosporin
2 single use tube of First Aid Burn Cream
1 Burnaid Burn Gel
1 NexTemp disposable thermometer
1 bottle Refresh Tears
12 Orajel medicated tooth swabs
1 First Aid Pamplet

My first aid kit sits in a pocket in my trauma kit so I still have it as well as the following items: 

Trauma Kit – Ergodyne Arsenal 5215 Large Trauma Bag

Total weight including bag and EDC First Aid Kit – 15 lbs.
Nasopharyngeal Airway (sterile) (1) each of:
            24Fr
            26Fr
            28Fr
            30Fr
            32Fr
            34Fr
            36Fr
(5) Dyna Lube single use packets (sterile) size 2.7 g #1250
(2) rolls 3m Micropore tape 1 inch
(1) roll sports tape 2 inch
(1) roll waterproof adhesive tape
(2) rolls Coban 2 inch bandage
(6) ½ in. x 4 in. Steri-strips
(9) 2 in x 4 in Flexible Adhesive Bandage
(100) ½ in X 2 ¾ in Butterfly Wound Closures
(10) 1 ¾ x 4 in Flexible Fabric bandages
(20) Orthoptic eye patches
(30) assorted size adhesive bandages
(40) 3/8 in x 1 ½ in adhesive bandages
(1) 40 in triangular bandage
(4) 2 in bandage compresses
(4) 5 in x 9 in surgical dressings
(2) 4 in x 4 in surgical sponges
(2) 3 in x 4 in non-stick pads
(3) 3 in x 8 in non-stick pads
(10) Black Talon nitrile gloves
(1) Adult resuscitator
(1) multi-fit cervical collar
(1) O2 mask with 7” tubing
(1) 36 in SAM Splint
(2) HALO seals
(1) Hyfin chest seal
(1) 13 piece surgical set *
(25) 2.5 M surgical blades
(1) 50 gram Quikclot
(2) 25 gram Quikclot
(1) 12 in abdominal bandage
(1) 6 in Israeli bandage
(1) self-administering tourniquet
(4) 2 in x 3 in burn pads
(2) chemical cold packs
(4) chemical hand warmers
(1) 1 ounce tube Bacitracin
(1) bottle 8 ounce wound wash
(1) 2.5 ounce tube SPF 30 sunscreen
(1) 4 ounce bottle hand sanitizer
(2) light weight casualty blankets
(1) mini Maglight
(1) sphygmometer
(1) Stethoscope
(30) Halls cough drops
(1) insect bite relief stick
(1) package tums
(1) ring cutter
(2) tweezers
(2) EMT sheers
(1) 4x6 waterproof notepad
(1) Rite in the rain ink pen
(2) 0.5 fluid ounce bottles lubricant eye drops
(1) pealess whistle
(1) BIC lighter
(1) Buck mini folder knife
(1) .75 ounce Badger Bug Balm
(1) Dentemp for lost fillings and loose caps
(1) Red Cross toothache kit
25 feet paracord

* I don't intend to do surgery with the kit but the various forceps and other tools could be very handy.

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## Survive

> I know this is an older thread but rather than start a new one I thought I'd just add to this one. Same subject. 
> 
> As my grand kids have gotten older and involved more and more into sports I was concerned that my EDC First aid kit just wasn't enough for some of the weird injuries sports can give you. Gym floors are wood and hard. All you have to do is bounce a young noggin' off the floor to have a very serious, potentially life threatening, injury. My grand kids are into softball, baseball, volleyball and basketball at this stage so that's a lot of different environments to contend with. With that in mind, I built a full trauma kit around my first aid kid. Hopefully, it's enough to keep a kid breathing until EMTs can take over, which is my only goal. Gotta keep them going during that 1st golden hour. Just some things for you to think about and critique if you choose. 
> 
> I've posted above but just to keep it straight here's my EDC first aid kit. 
> 
> First Aid Kit – Condor Rip Away Pouch
> 
> Total weight including pouch is 2lb 9oz.
> ...




I manage an ambulance company in PA and what you carry in your pack is more advanced then what most EMTs or Paramedics will carry in a First in bag

The 2 things that I carry that you don't (although you carry much more) is a SOF tourniquet, very handy of you know what to do with it and oral airways neonatal to large adult

If interested ill post a list of my pack

Two other things on my mind:
1. You carry a NRM but no O2 what is your intention or is that meant for a tourniquet 
2. If you are 1st aid only you are taking a large risk using this on anyone due to standard protocols what is your thought on this

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## Rick

1. My tourniquet is an SOF (see self applied tourniquet). 
2. I would never take the risk of a an oral airway. I'm not trained and could easily cause serious and permanent injuries. It's the reason I carry nasopharyngeal airways. A very underrated option to airway support. 
3. As you know, O2 can be supplied directly using the resuscitator. The O2 tubing is there "just in case" it's needed. O2 would be a handy thing to have I guess but acquiring it via welding O2 or aircraft O2 has it's own risk via litigation and medical O2 requires a script so.....
4. There is nothing in the kit that would put me at risk. My state has a Good Samaritan law. It's called "gratuitous emergency care" and the provider is immune from civil liability for personal injuries resulting from actions or inactions in trying to render aid. Except for gross negligence of willful misconduct I'm covered. I don't know how non-medical O2 would be viewed if it in fact caused a problem so I stay away from it. 

In the case of an arterial bleed my first recourse would be QuikClot with compression bandages. A tourniquet would only be used as a last resort. And remember, my concern here is my grand kids not necessarily Joe Victim on the street but would not hesitate to help if it was needed. So far, my involvement has been for chemical ice packs for other kids that have been injured and was glad to help. 

Please post your pack. I'm always interested in seeing what others have. One of the things I did was research what EMTs carry in my state and try to get as close as I could given my knowledge and training. I couldn't fix a pneumothorax for example but could help with a sucking chest wound. Just got to remember to count the holes and hope for an even number.

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## Old Professor

The one thing that I carry and would suggest is inflatable splints. They cushon as well as hold the injured part rigid.

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## Rick

OP - I was looking at those very things just before logging on. I agree. I found some reasonably priced: Foot/ankle for $6.00 plus shipping. I'm going to pick up some and add it to my kit. I have the SAM Splint but I like the idea of an air cushioned splint for the foot especially for strains/sprains. There is no picture on their web page but there is in their catalog. Looks like this however: 

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http://www.goldnuggetsurplus.com/mm5...uct_Code=FG254

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## tacmedic

Rick- you may want to check on that good samaritan law.  In Iowa we also have that as well but (in the Iowa version anyway) as soon as you do something that any other "lay person" would not be able to do (I.e. the applying the c-collar or the chest seal)you have crossed the line from being a good samaritan and you are now practicing medicine without a license which, in Iowa anyway, is a class D felony and punishable by a $5,000 fine and up to 5 years in jail.    Just something that you may want to check on to be safe.  There have been a couple of people recently who have been prosecuted here within the past few years for similar things.

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## Rick

Teach thy necessity to reason thus;
There is no virtue like necessity. — Richard II, Act I, sc. 3

"Oh, yeah I have the stuff to fix you right up but I might get into trouble." 

Indeed, there is no mention of criminal liability only civil. Still, it's my grand kids, you know?

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## tacmedic

I know what you mean about wanting to take care of your own family, and I would also rather face possible punishment than stand idly by and watch someone die.  The problem that I have is the people who think they are doctors when the only training or experience they have is watching ER on TV.  I think the point of those laws is to provide an outlet to punish people who hold themselves out to be something they aren't.

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## Rick

The upside to having all the equipment is that there are so many parents at these games/practices that one of them might be a doctor, EMT or someone that stayed at a Holiday Inn last night. I would be more than willing to turn it over to someone with superior knowledge.

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## Survive

Rick here is my kit

Pack:
5.11 6x6 med pack

Contents:
10 sterile 4x4 gauze 
5 sterile 2x2 gauze
1 roll of water proof silk tape
7 triple antibiotic packets
1 triangle bandage
1 3 inch Ace bandage
1 9 inch SAM splint
1 SOF tourniquet 
1 pocket CPR mask
10 glucose tablets
5 pairs of nitrile gloves
1 first aid booklet
1 pair of trauma sheers

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## Rick

I think you can handle just about any problem that comes along with that short of an airway issue or tooth problem. You can improvise any of those items. A 2X2 gauze and some tape can serve just as well as a bandaid. I'm admittedly anal retentive and have to have all the bases covered. I agonize over what should and shouldn't be in my pack for just a week-ender.

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## welderguy

> I think you can handle just about any problem that comes along with that short of an airway issue or tooth problem. You can improvise any of those items. A 2X2 gauze and some tape can serve just as well as a bandaid. I'm admittedly anal retentive and have to have all the bases covered. I agonize over what should and shouldn't be in my pack for just a week-ender.


I have a fully stocked ALS bag ( that i always carry), a BLS bag in my jeep, a BLS bag at the shop, and I have a dedicated GSW kit for the deer lease. Now maybe you dont feel so bad about Trying to cover all the bases!

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## Alaskan Sass

OOOH good advice here! Thanks!!!  I didn't see this mentioned and hope it applies to this thread-  One thing you can do if you don't want to constantly be updating those scripts for Antibiotics with an MD is go to a pet store ( probably not your local Pet-whatever- store) and pick up a bottle of Fish Mox, Fish cillan  or Fish Flex.  I keep a bottle around my place for those times when I just know instinctively that something is going on that requires an antibiotic but its not worth going to a Dr over. I also have one that I keep in my car with my winter gear.  I normally just grab the Fish Flex for the strength.   The ones I get are premeasured capsules (250mg) and I just take them as I would if I got them from an MD. They have a GREAT shelf life- the ones I have now Ive had for over a year and dont expire for a months.  The only thing Ive read on them that makes them different is they aren't approved so they aren't supposed to be for human consumption. I first learned about them when I worked in a pet store and found out Dog Mushers buy them for when they are on the trail.  I personally have had no issues with them other then my boss telling me that shes waiting for me to start gurgling when she knows I'm taking them!

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## Rick

We've had quite a discussion on pet meds with those in favor of and those opposed. I'm in the "I don't think so" camp because they are not approved for humans. But that's just me. I'm kinda funny about what goes in my mouth. Not so much about what I wear though.

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## tnrick55

I'm a ex emt advance  and it seems you guys thought your kits out very well i'm proud of you.

TO ANSWER YOUR QUESTION I THINK IF A PERSON COULD LEARN INTERVEINOUS THERAPY FOR BLOOD LOSS OR DEHYDRATION .THIS WOULD ONLY BE USED IN THE CASE OF  EVERYTHING BREAKING  DOWN WITH ARE MEDICAL SERVICE.

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## Alaskan Sass

Oh believe me... every time I take one that thought crosses my mind.  I figure Im old enough now that unhealthy things that could affect me are lining up and taking a number.  :Smile:

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## Wildernesstech

Just wanted to comment in order to bring this older post to the forefront again so new forum members might read it.

I carry MUCH more in the sailboat, but we are often in the true middle of nowhere and may not have any access to reliable medical care.

The posts above have been well thought out, and I love the idea of the small size and weight of the Condor Kit.  If it is easy to grab, you are far more likely to carry it with you!

The attitude that expired supplies means you are living a blessed life is the one to adopt in any survival situation... You are either blessed because you didn't need it (my preference), or blessed because you had it when you needed it (and it wasn't expired)!

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## welderguy

> We've had quite a discussion on pet meds with those in favor of and those opposed. I'm in the "I don't think so" camp because they are not approved for humans. But that's just me. I'm kinda funny about what goes in my mouth. Not so much about what I wear though.


 DO NOT TRY THIS AT HOME CHILDREN!!!! But I got seriously sick contracted MRSA staff , Well I didn't have money for a Doctor so I ordered some pet meds off ebay took the course of antibiotics I needed and BOOM it went away, I do however have a strong desire to chase cars, and the mailman.
 The pills I took I pulled up on drug.com and they were an exact match to what is perscribed for humans and on th elabel the maker was the same as for humans . just my experience with this. In NO WAY AM I SAYING ANYONE SHOULD DO THIS!!!!!

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## Ranger_Spencer

Hey Rick, where and how exactly did you manage to get the 30 Hydrocodone 500 Mg tabs for your kit? Isn't that a restricted drug? Or am I wrong? Did you have some left over from a script or...?

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## welderguy

> Hey Rick, where and how exactly did you manage to get the 30 Hydrocodone 500 Mg tabs for your kit? Isn't that a restricted drug? Or am I wrong? Did you have some left over from a script or...?


 As long as his name is on the prescription bottle you can carry any drugs your prescribed. I have narcotics in my bag all prescribed to me.

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## Rick

I just asked my Dr for them. If you have a good relationship with your doctor and he/she knows you like to travel in the back country and aren't in their office every week wanting pain pills then they shouldn't have a problem writing up a script for them. I simply told him we like to spend time outdoors and wanted an analgesic in case we had a serious accident and had to spend the night waiting for help. I wanted something to take the edge off a broken leg or similar but still allow me to think straight to do the things I might need to do like signalling or staying hydrated. It won't do you much good if something is so strong it knocks you out and you have no way of signalling your rescuers. 

I also requested a broad spectrum antibiotic that would buy us a window of time to seek medical help if we came down with something cruddy like giardia. I'm pretty careful about how I handle water but cross contamination can occur. 

Your doctor shouldn't have a big issue with writing a script for an analgesic for a couple of days and a broad spectrum antibiotic for maybe a week. Just depends on where you plan on going and how long. If they won't do that then you might think about another doctor. I wouldn't go waltzing in there asking for Oxy or morphine but rather explain what you want and let them make the judgement on what that should be.

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## RandyRhoads

Same with me. My drugs include Oxy,vikadin,Valium,albuterol, and Epi.   If your doctor is good, they will understand better to have and not need.... Pretty much all of my drugs get wasted.

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## Ranger_Spencer

Well holy crap. Iv been to the doctor several times and he wouldnt even give me pain medicine when I HAD pain. And now I learn you can get it as a just in case sort of deal? Wow. I always knew my Dr. was crap but man.

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## Rick

I would imagine every doctor has their fair share of those who will do and say anything to get a script for pain pills. I can see it making them jaded to everyone. And I'm sure they also know the tell tell signs to look for in patients like that. I would think in your profession it would be the easiest thing in the world to get those kind of scripts. Not only are you off trail and risking serious injury but there's the ever present bad guy with marijuana fields or poachers that you are apt to run into. You of all people should be carrying something just in case.

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## welderguy

it also helps in my case being an EMT. But what i have in my personal bag I have acquired from my doctor. If the chit hits the fan I can get restocked thru my dept till it runs out then when im down to the last batch of my narcs in my ALS bag, then IM out and will horde that for my family . our emergency plan is to distribute all the narcs to the EMS so they can stay in the field, don't sound like a good idea to me but Im just  lowly medic.

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## Ranger_Spencer

Oh man, Rick, remind me at some point in a more related thread to tell you about some of those people Iv ran across. Whew boy.

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## Rick

Just think what you would do if you took a round in the thigh during a snowstorm at 9:00 at night, stepped into a booby trap or simply sprained an ankle bad enough you couldn't walk on it...in those conditions. You're probably going to have to hunker down for the night even if you are in radio contact. I just don't see any reason to endure a lot of pain on top of bad conditions on top of being injured when it's so easy to fix the pain part. And yeah, I imagine there are plenty of crazies out there to deal with. My hat's off to you guys. I'd shoot one too many for being stupid and probably lose my job.

Supervisor: "Again?"
Me: "Hey, is it my fault he was stupid?"
Supervisor: "That's four this month not counting the two you wounded."
Me: "They were just dumb. If they had been stupid I wouldn't have wounded them."

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